2025 Fees

[Nenikikamen23]

Man, I know I'm repeating myself and I know we're discussing this in the context of his accomplishments/starting fee, but it's crazy to me that the American market counts American Pharoah a flop. Like, just looking at it here....

- Sire of 9 G1Ws (2 champions, one a 2yo in Europe on turf and one an older horse in Japan on dirt)
- Sire of a BC Juv. Turf Sprint winner
- G1 wins over 8.0f - 12.5f on turf
- G1 wins over 6.0f - 8.0f on dirt
- G1 wins in the US, Australia, France, Japan
- GSWs in the US, Canada, Australia, Japan, New Zealand, France, Ireland, Great Britain, Hong Kong

- 1st 2019 (USA) G2 Breeders' Cup Juvenile Turf Sprint (Four Wheel Drive)
- 2nd 2023 (USA) G1 Breeders' Cup Juvenile Fillies (Jody's Pride)
- 3rd 2021 (USA) G1 Breeders' Cup Juvenile Turf (Mackinnon)
- 3rd 2020 (USA) G1 Breeders' Cup Filly & Mare Turf (Harvey's Lil Goil)
- 3rd 2019 (USA) G1 Breeders' Cup Juvenile Fillies Turf (Sweet Melania)

- 1st 2024 (AUS) G1 Australian Derby (Riff Rocket)
- 1st 2020 (JPN) JPN1 Japan Dirt Derby (Danon Pharoah)
- 1st 2024 (AUS) G1 Rosehill Guineas (Riff Rocket)
- 3rd 2021 (IRE) G1 Irish 2,000 Guineas (Van Gogh)
- 3rd 2021 (IRE) G1 Irish Oaks (Nicest)

He certainly isn't a $200,000 sire, but since the U.S. vastly underappreciates turf sires he doesn't get the respect he deserves. I wasn't really a fan of his during his career, but as a sire he's won me over. Wish they'd keep him in the $30-40k range, maybe try him out standing a season in Europe or Japan. He's got a lot to offer breeders, just maybe not the ones here.

[Flanders]

Man, I know I'm repeating myself and I know we're discussing this in the context of his accomplishments/starting fee, but it's crazy to me that the American market counts American Pharoah a flop. Like, just looking at it here....

- Sire of 9 G1Ws (2 champions, one a 2yo in Europe on turf and one an older horse in Japan on dirt)
- Sire of a BC Juv. Turf Sprint winner
- G1 wins over 8.0f - 12.5f on turf
- G1 wins over 6.0f - 8.0f on dirt
- G1 wins in the US, Australia, France, Japan
- GSWs in the US, Canada, Australia, Japan, New Zealand, France, Ireland, Great Britain, Hong Kong

- 1st 2019 (USA) G2 Breeders' Cup Juvenile Turf Sprint (Four Wheel Drive)
- 2nd 2023 (USA) G1 Breeders' Cup Juvenile Fillies (Jody's Pride)
- 3rd 2021 (USA) G1 Breeders' Cup Juvenile Turf (Mackinnon)
- 3rd 2020 (USA) G1 Breeders' Cup Filly & Mare Turf (Harvey's Lil Goil)
- 3rd 2019 (USA) G1 Breeders' Cup Juvenile Fillies Turf (Sweet Melania)

- 1st 2024 (AUS) G1 Australian Derby (Riff Rocket)
- 1st 2020 (JPN) JPN1 Japan Dirt Derby (Danon Pharoah)
- 1st 2024 (AUS) G1 Rosehill Guineas (Riff Rocket)
- 3rd 2021 (IRE) G1 Irish 2,000 Guineas (Van Gogh)
- 3rd 2021 (IRE) G1 Irish Oaks (Nicest)

He certainly isn't a $200,000 sire, but since the U.S. vastly underappreciates turf sires he doesn't get the respect he deserves. I wasn't really a fan of his during his career, but as a sire he's won me over. Wish they'd keep him in the $30-40k range, maybe try him out standing a season in Europe or Japan. He's got a lot to offer breeders, just maybe not the ones here.

The market hasn't abandoned him. They are just adjusting his fee because he didn't have the best year. He got 150+ mares in 2024 and he had a million dollar yearling. Everyone is acting like they put him at 5k. He only went down 5k in price from this year.... Maybe he'll do better with cheaper mares, some stallions do.

[Northport]

American Pharoah once stood stud for $200k. To see him dip that low is totally deja vu to how Fusaichi Pegasus did for their farm. I wouldn't be surprised, if he goes the same route. I think FuPeg was at $150k and went down to $7,500 before he passed.

Has any stallion flopped harder than Pharoah?

He literally sired the winner of the G1 Victoria Derby on Saturday - for the second year in a row. If you want a flop, go look at Smarty Jones' fee trajectory.

[KatieK101]

Yeah, I’m not sure anyone in the industry considers him a flop. He probably hasn’t lived up to their expectations as a sire but that does not equate to being a flop.

[Nenikikamen23]

Have all farms now reported fees? And are there any more incoming stallions to Kentucky that have yet to have fees released? I think the only one is possibly-more-than-likely Sierra Leone, right?

[Northport]

The expectations for the two (?) stallions that started with fees of $200,000 are obviously going to be close to impossible to meet. Ghostzapper had gradual and consistent fee drops, before eventually levelling out and proving to be a very good, tough not terribly fashionable, stallion. I would give American Pharoah a couple of years before writing him off completely. I really am surprised they didn't shuttle him to Australia this year, something about him clearly works down there.

[Nenikikamen23]

The expectations for the two (?) stallions that started with fees of $200,000 are obviously going to be close to impossible to meet. Ghostzapper had gradual and consistent fee drops, before eventually levelling out and proving to be a very good, tough not terribly fashionable, stallion. I would give American Pharoah a couple of years before writing him off completely. I really am surprised they didn't shuttle him to Australia this year, something about him clearly works down there.

I think they were resting him this year, but honestly I was surprised they didn't keep him in AUS and rest him on NH time given his recent results.
"Triple Crown winners Justify and American Pharoah will not shuttle to Coolmore Australia this year … A decision was made to rest the two stallions, but both should be back the following year."

[Retrospectiv]

American Pharoah once stood stud for $200k. To see him dip that low is totally deja vu to how Fusaichi Pegasus did for their farm. I wouldn't be surprised, if he goes the same route. I think FuPeg was at $150k and went down to $7,500 before he passed.

Has any stallion flopped harder than Pharoah?

He literally sired the winner of the G1 Victoria Derby on Saturday - for the second year in a row. If you want a flop, go look at Smarty Jones' fee trajectory.

Seriously

Actually, look at several of the high profile, high fee HOTY/Champion stallions that entered stud just at Three Chimneys in the 1990s/2000s...
Silver Charm
Point Given
Smarty Jones

They got very lucky with Gun Runner given the gamble they took and the major flops of those prior stallions.

All MUCH bigger flops than AP

[Starine]

Man, I know I'm repeating myself and I know we're discussing this in the context of his accomplishments/starting fee, but it's crazy to me that the American market counts American Pharoah a flop. Like, just looking at it here....

- Sire of 9 G1Ws (2 champions, one a 2yo in Europe on turf and one an older horse in Japan on dirt)
- Sire of a BC Juv. Turf Sprint winner
- G1 wins over 8.0f - 12.5f on turf
- G1 wins over 6.0f - 8.0f on dirt
- G1 wins in the US, Australia, France, Japan
- GSWs in the US, Canada, Australia, Japan, New Zealand, France, Ireland, Great Britain, Hong Kong

- 1st 2019 (USA) G2 Breeders' Cup Juvenile Turf Sprint (Four Wheel Drive)
- 2nd 2023 (USA) G1 Breeders' Cup Juvenile Fillies (Jody's Pride)
- 3rd 2021 (USA) G1 Breeders' Cup Juvenile Turf (Mackinnon)
- 3rd 2020 (USA) G1 Breeders' Cup Filly & Mare Turf (Harvey's Lil Goil)
- 3rd 2019 (USA) G1 Breeders' Cup Juvenile Fillies Turf (Sweet Melania)

- 1st 2024 (AUS) G1 Australian Derby (Riff Rocket)
- 1st 2020 (JPN) JPN1 Japan Dirt Derby (Danon Pharoah)
- 1st 2024 (AUS) G1 Rosehill Guineas (Riff Rocket)
- 3rd 2021 (IRE) G1 Irish 2,000 Guineas (Van Gogh)
- 3rd 2021 (IRE) G1 Irish Oaks (Nicest)

Don't forget grade/group I winners Marketsegmentation, Cafe Pharoah, American Theorem, Goldrush Guru, Above the Curve, As Time Goes By....

[Nenikikamen23]

Man, I know I'm repeating myself and I know we're discussing this in the context of his accomplishments/starting fee, but it's crazy to me that the American market counts American Pharoah a flop. Like, just looking at it here....

- Sire of 9 G1Ws (2 champions, one a 2yo in Europe on turf and one an older horse in Japan on dirt)
- Sire of a BC Juv. Turf Sprint winner
- G1 wins over 8.0f - 12.5f on turf
- G1 wins over 6.0f - 8.0f on dirt
- G1 wins in the US, Australia, France, Japan
- GSWs in the US, Canada, Australia, Japan, New Zealand, France, Ireland, Great Britain, Hong Kong

- 1st 2019 (USA) G2 Breeders' Cup Juvenile Turf Sprint (Four Wheel Drive)
- 2nd 2023 (USA) G1 Breeders' Cup Juvenile Fillies (Jody's Pride)
- 3rd 2021 (USA) G1 Breeders' Cup Juvenile Turf (Mackinnon)
- 3rd 2020 (USA) G1 Breeders' Cup Filly & Mare Turf (Harvey's Lil Goil)
- 3rd 2019 (USA) G1 Breeders' Cup Juvenile Fillies Turf (Sweet Melania)

- 1st 2024 (AUS) G1 Australian Derby (Riff Rocket)
- 1st 2020 (JPN) JPN1 Japan Dirt Derby (Danon Pharoah)
- 1st 2024 (AUS) G1 Rosehill Guineas (Riff Rocket)
- 3rd 2021 (IRE) G1 Irish 2,000 Guineas (Van Gogh)
- 3rd 2021 (IRE) G1 Irish Oaks (Nicest)

Don't forget grade/group I winners Marketsegmentation, Cafe Pharoah, American Theorem, Goldrush Guru, Above the Curve, As Time Goes By....

"
Yes, they were included in the count for how many G1 winners he has. "...Sire of 9 G1Ws (2 champions, one a 2yo in Europe on turf and one an older horse in Japan on dirt)"

[RugbyGirl]

American Pharoah had 16 live foals from (about) 25 mares served in his last year in Australia he was not popular at all. Despite 2x Derby winners since then I doubt he would get much better numbers if he comes back.

[Slewfan2]

Yeah, I’m not sure anyone in the industry considers him a flop. He probably hasn’t lived up to their expectations as a sire but that does not equate to being a flop.

It’s all relative. He was bred to incredible mares, and his offspring sold incredibly well

He’s been a solid sire, but nothing more, especially here on dirt

[Nenikikamen23]

Some incoming newbies in Europe;

Charyn (IRE) - €35,000
Fantastic Moon (GER) - €9,000
Puchkine (IRE) - €8,500
Feed The Flame (GB) - €4,500
My Prospero (IRE) - €3,000

Vandeek (GB) - £15,000
Isaac Shelby (GB) - £7,000

[Northport]

Haras d'Etreham

Hello Youmzain - €40,000 (€22,500)
Victor Ludorum - €15,000 (same) - new to Etreham as part of a partnership with Darley, previously stood at Darley's Haras du Logis
Persian King - €25,000 (same)
Onestro - €12,000 (€12,500)
City Light - €10,000 (€7,000)

Hello Youmzain was the leading first crop sire in France with a G2 and a G3 winner in his first crop... but almost doubling his fee seems a bit ambitious.

Missing from the roster is Almanzor. You want to talk about stallions that flopped... look no further. He did start at the very reasonable fee of €35,000 and slid down to €10,000 in 2024, but he was a great racehorse with the right pedigree and support who just did not take off.

But, like AP, he seems to have fared better in the Southern Hemisphere. He is still on Cambridge Stud's website, so I imagine he is staying there.

[Flanders]

Haras d'Etreham

Hello Youmzain - €40,000 (€22,500)
Victor Ludorum - €15,000 (same) - new to Etreham as part of a partnership with Darley, previously stood at Darley's Haras du Logis
Persian King - €25,000 (same)
Onestro - €12,000 (€12,500)
City Light - €10,000 (€7,000)

Hello Youmzain was the leading first crop sire in France with a G2 and a G3 winner in his first crop... but almost doubling his fee seems a bit ambitious.

Missing from the roster is Almanzor. You want to talk about stallions that flopped... look no further. He did start at the very reasonable fee of €35,000 and slid down to €10,000 in 2024, but he was a great racehorse with the right pedigree and support who just did not take off.

But, like AP, he seems to have fared better in the Southern Hemisphere. He is still on Cambridge Stud's website, so I imagine he is staying there.

I remember posting not that long ago in Stallion News, that he was staying in New Zealand.

[Northport]

Haras d'Etreham

Hello Youmzain - €40,000 (€22,500)
Victor Ludorum - €15,000 (same) - new to Etreham as part of a partnership with Darley, previously stood at Darley's Haras du Logis
Persian King - €25,000 (same)
Onestro - €12,000 (€12,500)
City Light - €10,000 (€7,000)

Hello Youmzain was the leading first crop sire in France with a G2 and a G3 winner in his first crop... but almost doubling his fee seems a bit ambitious.

Missing from the roster is Almanzor. You want to talk about stallions that flopped... look no further. He did start at the very reasonable fee of €35,000 and slid down to €10,000 in 2024, but he was a great racehorse with the right pedigree and support who just did not take off.

But, like AP, he seems to have fared better in the Southern Hemisphere. He is still on Cambridge Stud's website, so I imagine he is staying there.

I remember posting not that long ago in Stallion News, that he was staying in New Zealand.

Well there you go! Missed that. Definitely the right move for him.

[Diver52]

American Pharoah had 16 live foals from (about) 25 mares served in his last year in Australia he was not popular at all. Despite 2x Derby winners since then I doubt he would get much better numbers if he comes back.

That's surprising, I would have thought that at a reasonable fee he'd have been more popular. He's still getting 100+ books here.

[stelladaniella]

War of Will (War Front) - $20,000

[tachyon]

Shadai Stallion Station has announced stud fees for 2025 today!
Euinox, Kitasan Black and Kizuna are the most expensive stallions at Shadai.

Sire Name (Sire of Sire) : stud fee 2025 in JPY --- (stud fee 2024 in JPY)

Admire Mars(JPN) (Daiwa Major) : 5,000,000 (2,500,000)
Bricks and Mortar(USA) (Giant's Causeway) : 4,000,000 (6,000,000)
Chrysoberyl(JPN) (Gold Allure) : 2,500,000 (3,000,000)
Contrail(JPN) (Deep Impact) : 18,000,000 (15,000,000)
Danon Kingly(JPN) (Deep Impact) : 1,500,000 (1,500,000)
Drefong(USA) (Gio Ponti) : 5,000,000 (6,000,000)
Efforia(JPN) (Epiphaneia) : 4,000,000 (4,000,000)
Epiphaneia(JPN) (Symboli Kris S) : 12,000,000 (15,000,000)
Equinox(JPN) (Kitasan Black) 20,000,000 (20,000,000)
Grenadier Guards(JPN) (Frankel) 1,500,000 (1,500,000)
Harbinger(GB) (Dansili) : private (private)
Hot Rod Charlie(USA) (Oxbow) : 1,500,000 (1,500,000)
Isla Bonita(JPN) (Fuji Kiseki) : 2,000,000 (2,000,000)
Kitasan Black(JPN) (Black Tide) : 20,000,000 (20,000,000)
Kizuna(JPN) (Deep Impact) : 20,000,000 (12,000,000)
Le Vent Se Leve(JPN) (Symboli Kris S) : 2,500,000 (3,000,000)
Lord Kanaloa(JPN) (King Kamehameha) : 10,000,000 (12,000,000)
Maurice(JPN) (Screen Hero) : 8,000,000 (8,000,000)
Mind Your Biscuits(USA) (Posse) : 2,000,000 (3,000,000)
Nadal(USA) (Blame) : 10,000,000 (3,000,000)
Orfevre(JPN) (Stay Gold) : 3,500,000 (3,500,000)
Poetic Flare(IRE) (Dawn Approach) : private (private)
Rey de Oro(JPN) (King Kamehameha) : 2,500,000 (5,000,000)
Rulership (King Kamehameha) : 4,000,000 (3,500,000)
Salios (Heart's Cry) : 2,000,000 (2,000,000)
Satono Crown(JPN) (Marju) : 1,500,000 (2,000,000):
Saturnalia(JPN) (Lord Kanaloa) : 10,000,000 (8,000,000)
Schenell Meister(GER) 3,500,000 (3,500,000)
Siskin(USA) (First Defence) : 3,000,000 (2,000,000)
Suave Richard(JPN) (Heart's Cry) : 15,000,000 (15,000,000)
New Year's Day(USA) (Street Cry) : relocated to Yushun

https://shadai-ss.com/cms/wp-content/up ... 2n_SSS.pdf

[Nenikikamen23]

Ocala Stud

$8,500 - Win Win Win ($5,000)
$7,500 - Roadster ($7,500)
$6,500 - Colonel Liam ($6,500)
$6,000 - Khozan ($6,500 at Journeyman Stallions)
$5,000 - Seeking the Soul ($5,000)
$4,000 - Awesome Slew ($4,000)
$3,000 - Adios Charlie ($3,000)
$3,000 - Gretzky the Great ($3,000)