2024 BREEDERS CUP news and notes

[sweettalk]

If owners want to share the info, they should, but I could also seeing it being a very slippery slope. After being involved with many MRH horses, I could see PETA and witch hunters having a field day with how easy Thoroughbreds injure themselves. You just look at them wrong and they require 60 days off it seems.

right, exactly. i super get it, i fully understand, and respect, the exact reasons why they don't share. but it's just very frustrating that the lack of transparency is such a hot topic and it's ppl like some of those rabid zenyatta fans while she was breeding, or that crazy poster we banned (but is still on twitter) that reinforce the decisions to keep it this way. i just super wish there was a way we could still get info/updates but without setting off the rotten apples. bums me out there really isn't a way.

[tachyon]

@DRFWelsch
Ushba Tesoro really feeling good this a.m., dropped down to the rail for an impromptu blowout after making official work tab yesterday. Went a quarter in :25 and change wire out before rider was able to slow him down nearing five-eighths pole.

That's good to hear!
If he is in his game and if a hot pace develops, Ushba is going to be the first Japanese to win the BC Classic!! (I hope, haha!)

How do you feel about Derma? He has been full of energy this week. He did NOT want to stop today, it seemed like his rider was doing everything to get him to slow down and he was like NO LET ME RUN!

I can't believe that Derma Sotogake can win the Classic this year, as his prep race in Funabashi was quite disappointing.
But he has the tactical speed to race upfront in one pace and definitely likes the conventional dirt better than the sand.
I may just use him for the bottom of exotics (trifecta).

[CoronadosQuest]

RAMATUELLE scratched from Breeders Cup Mile

https://x.com/ArthurHoyeau/status/18522 ... 15/photo/1

[Tessablue]

RAMATUELLE scratched from Breeders Cup Mile

https://x.com/ArthurHoyeau/status/18522 ... 15/photo/1

Ooof that is a HUGE defection. I guess the BC really has it out for promising Head-trained 3yo fillies in the Mile...

[CoronadosQuest]

RAMATUELLE scratched from Breeders Cup Mile

https://x.com/ArthurHoyeau/status/18522 ... 15/photo/1

Ooof that is a HUGE defection. I guess the BC really has it out for promising Head-trained 3yo fillies in the Mile...

Yeah... they seem rather unhappy

[CoronadosQuest]

Diego Velazquez (IRE) scratched from Turf Mile

https://x.com/aobrienfansite/status/1852408207425130896

[Tessablue]

Yeah... they seem rather unhappy

After Polydream, it has to feel a little personal. It's a tough spot for the BC vets to be in, because they don't know these horses but can't afford to make a mistake. I can't imagine anyone from the Head family sending an unsound horse, and they'd structured the filly's campaign around this race. But you want the vets to be totally unbiased as well... just tough for everyone, including the fans and bettors. Oh well.

The Mile is really taking some hits today, geeze.

[BaroqueAgain1]

Does it feel like it's the Euro shippers that are being especially targeted? Can't imagine that these scratches are going to encourage European connections to return to the BC.

[HB1994]

Kind of insane that Sierra Leone isn't in the top 10. He's a pretty big player.

Maybe it's good that people have run from his bandwagon. That usually spells victory.

I’m gonna laugh my ass off if SL wins the BCC instead of City of Troy.

I didn’t. I was actually hoping City of Troy would pull it off so we could stop hearing about AOB being 0-fer in the BCC.

[Missbeholder]

I have a question about "repeat" Breeders Cup winners.

I believe that Rebel's Romance today became the 5th horse to repeat in a Breeders Cup race in non-consecutive years. I just wanted to check here to be sure that I haven't forgotten anybody, or missed anybody in checking. Four of the five that I counted have taken place in the last 20 years.

Da Hoss -- Breeders Cup Mile -- 1996 & 1998
Ouija Board -- Breeders Cup Filly & Mare Turf -- 2004 & 2006
Beholder -- Breeders Cup Distaff -- 2013 & 2016 (2 years between victories)
Monomoy Girl -- Breeders Cup Distaff -- 2018 & 2020
Rebel's Romance -- Breeders Cup Turf -- 2022 & 2024

All the other repeat Breeders Cup race winners that I could account for accomplished their wins in consecutive years, including Goldikova with her three consecutive Breeders Cup Mile victories. I'm interested in this statistic just because winning a Breeders Cup race twice in non-consecutive years carries the aura of a certain amount of longevity while retaining form over a period of time. That's something we could do with as much of as we can get!

This is certainly not to negate the accomplishment of horses who have won their Breeders Cup races in consecutive years! Lord, Goldikova is the epitome of the longevity and retaining form premise! I just have a specific aspect of the repeat statistic that I'm looking at here, and it's really something that hasn't happened very often over 41 runnings of the event!

By the way, did I forget or miss anybody? 🫣

[Missbeholder]

I have a question about "repeat" Breeders Cup winners.

I believe that Rebel's Romance today became the 5th horse to repeat in a Breeders Cup race in non-consecutive years. I just wanted to check here to be sure that I haven't forgotten anybody, or missed anybody in checking. Four of the five that I counted have taken place in the last 20 years.

Da Hoss -- Breeders Cup Mile -- 1996 & 1998
Ouija Board -- Breeders Cup Filly & Mare Turf -- 2004 & 2006
Beholder -- Breeders Cup Distaff -- 2013 & 2016 (2 years between victories)
Monomoy Girl -- Breeders Cup Distaff -- 2018 & 2020
Rebel's Romance -- Breeders Cup Turf -- 2022 & 2024

All the other repeat Breeders Cup race winners that I could account for accomplished their wins in consecutive years, including Goldikova with her three consecutive Breeders Cup Mile victories. I'm interested in this statistic just because winning a Breeders Cup race twice in non-consecutive years carries the aura of a certain amount of longevity while retaining form over a period of time. That's something we could do with as much of as we can get!

This is certainly not to negate the accomplishment of horses who have won their Breeders Cup races in consecutive years! Lord, Goldikova is the epitome of the longevity and retaining form premise! I just have a specific aspect of the repeat statistic that I'm looking at here, and it's really something that hasn't happened very often over 41 runnings of the event!

By the way, did I forget or miss anybody? 🫣

[Missbeholder]

I apologize for the duplicate post. I tried to delete one of them but it didn't work. Perhaps Kurenai can help me out .

[Izvestia]

Muth and Seize the Gray sure didn’t show up today.

[barbaro111]

Muth and Seize the Gray sure didn’t show up today.

I'm not surprised about Muth- He has been disappointing iMO in past races. I was disappointed in STG.

[Izvestia]

Both are retired now, correct?

[Tessablue]

Both are retired now, correct?

Seize the Grey yes, Muth’s stud deal announcement didn’t say anything but I’d be surprised if we saw him again.

[Tessablue]

Okay so apparently Sierra Leone's retirement isn't a sure thing? Peter Brant is in the partnership and said he wants to see him at 4?

My kingdom for a Travers rematch next year...

[Missbeholder]

There was no realy dominant jockey this weekend. It seems to me that most Breeders Cups have a jockey that has a really good couple of days. As I recall, Ryan Moore and Flavien Prat were the only two jockeys this Breeders Cup that won as many as two races! And the really remarkable thing is that everybody's darling Irad Ortiz got completely SHUT OUT!! He was supposed to win on Cogburn, but he decided he couldn't lose so guess what? He did!

The Shoemaker Award is supposed to go to the "best" jockey of the Breeders Cup. Moore and Prat are tied with only two wins apiece. I think Flavien should get the nod just because the two races he won (Classic and F&M Turf) carry considerably more weight than Moore's two.....the Juvenile Turf and Juvenile Fillies Turf).

Guess we'll see what happens.

[Tessablue]

Winning Beyers:

Sprint: 103
Turf Sprint: 102
F&M Sprint: 98
Distaff: 100
Turf: 106
Dirt Mile: 104
Mile: not sure
F&M Turf: 100
Classic: 112

I just noticed that with this Classic figure, Sierra Leone has improved or maintained his highest Beyer in every start of his nine-race career. Really great training job to get this horse to straighten out (although I think he did come in again in this race, no head-on so it's hard to tell) and continue improving after starting off as a very nice 2yo, and no reason to think he wouldn't continue to improve at 4.

Fierceness, meanwhile, becomes the first 3yo to post three 110+ figures since... I think maybe Curlin? Not sure. Two really extraordinary colts this year, plus Forever Young who is surely going to get a G1 at some point if he stays healthy.

[Essential Quality]

If owners want to share the info, they should, but I could also seeing it being a very slippery slope. After being involved with many MRH horses, I could see PETA and witch hunters having a field day with how easy Thoroughbreds injure themselves. You just look at them wrong and they require 60 days off it seems.

I’m late to the party but worth remembering that Repole and Pletcher TRIED being transparent with Fierceness and the stuff on his hooves before the derby by having an article done. The public immediately saw it has he was unsound and had bad feet, as thoroughbreds are notorious for, but while Pletcher and the Farrier who does Fierceness’ hooves both confirmed that Fierceness has never taken a lame step in his life and it was used as a precaution. Then someone, a certain billionaire who’s mouth runs better then his horses, started a rumor on twitter that he had a quarter crack and was going to be scratched from the derby. Which he never did and obviously never happened.

Many trainers use the same stuff, you can see it on some Cox, Asmussen, Mott, Baffert horses.

So not only would they have to deal with peta, they would have to deal with crazy fans/crazy people making lies up about the animal for absolutely no reason.