Who is going to move?

[halo]

Good Samaritan to Haras Mochito Guapo in Chile.

[Akitaperson]

Good Samaritan to Haras Mochito Guapo in Chile.

Wonder how long it'll be before they kick Outwork and Tom. Given they have similar numbers to Good Samaritan

[Akitaperson]

Looking at the RMB post I won't be shock to see Tom leave Winstar

Tom's de'tat left?

No he hasn't but given his numbers I won't be shocked if he and outwork are on the chopping block eventually

[Flanders]

Looking at the RMB post I won't be shock to see Tom leave Winstar

Tom's de'tat left?

No he hasn't but given his numbers I won't be shocked if he and outwork are on the chopping block eventually

I agree about Outwork, he definitely made my list. I disagree about Tom's d'Etat at this point. His first crop is 2yos, that is why his RMB is low, plus he was a late bloomer himself. I think that was because he was plagued by injuries and issues but he didn't start racing until 3, didn't become a SW until 5, and a G1SW until 6 and raced at age 7. I'm not saying he won't move eventually because most new stallions will but they'll give him a year or two to see how his foals race. Given that they kept Always Dreaming and Good Samaritan until this year when their first crops were 4, makes me think they learned their lesson about moving on a stallion too early with Take Charge Indy and Daredevil. He got a nice winner at Saratoga a couple weeks ago in Strong State and is currently sitting higher on the Freshman sire list than their other 2 Freshman stallions.

[othybat_99]

I know this will sound kinda dumb, but what does it mean when a stallion is sold to stud? Does it mean the horse itself was sold or their breeding rights?

[Flanders]

I know this will sound kinda dumb, but what does it mean when a stallion is sold to stud? Does it mean the horse itself was sold or their breeding rights?

It sort of means the same thing, the farm is going to become the owner either way. They say sold when the horse is retired from racing already but when the horse is still racing that say breeding rights. The farm will get ownership when the horse retires but has no ownership stake until the horse retires. For example, Dornoch's breeding rights were acquired by Spendthrift. His current owners keep ownership until he retires and then he is owned by the Spendthrift. When its breeding rights there are also usually "kickers" involved in the price that say if the horse wins certain races, the farm has to pay more money to acquire him.

The farm then forms a syndicate for the stallion, so they aren't actually going to be the owner in the end. Which means they split his ownership into a certain number of shares that they then sell to breeders. Those shareholders can then sell their shares if they want, or offer the breeding to someone outside the ownership group(by telling the farm they don't want to use that year's breeding). For example, current leading freshman sire in the US, Complexity, had a share sell at Fasig Tipton on Tuesday for 510k. The shares usually allow 1 mare to be bred a year, sometimes a 2nd mare every other year. Its also the syndicate(shareholders) who decides if they want to sell a stallion after he has been at stud, like was done with Always Dreaming and Good Samaritan this year. Usually a farm will keep a certain amount of shares in a stallion, though they may get breedings as a maintenance fee for standing, taking care of mare bookings, caring for, advertising the stallion, etc. Rarely an owner will keep full or majority ownership of a stallion that goes to stud or more common is keeping a smaller percentage interest in the horse. For example, Stonestreet has the majority ownership in Curlin.

[TapitsGal]

I know this will sound kinda dumb, but what does it mean when a stallion is sold to stud? Does it mean the horse itself was sold or their breeding rights?

It sort of means the same thing, the farm is going to become the owner either way. They say sold when the horse is retired from racing already but when the horse is still racing that say breeding rights. The farm will get ownership when the horse retires but has no ownership stake until the horse retires. For example, Dornoch's breeding rights were acquired by Spendthrift. His current owners keep ownership until he retires and then he is owned by the Spendthrift. When its breeding rights there are also usually "kickers" involved in the price that say if the horse wins certain races, the farm has to pay more money to acquire him.

The farm then forms a syndicate for the stallion, so they aren't actually going to be the owner in the end. Which means they split his ownership into a certain number of shares that they then sell to breeders. Those shareholders can then sell their shares if they want, or offer the breeding to someone outside the ownership group(by telling the farm they don't want to use that year's breeding). For example, current leading freshman sire in the US, Complexity, had a share sell at Fasig Tipton on Tuesday for 510k. The shares usually allow 1 mare to be bred a year, sometimes a 2nd mare every other year. Its also the syndicate(shareholders) who decides if they want to sell a stallion after he has been at stud, like was done with Always Dreaming and Good Samaritan this year. Usually a farm will keep a certain amount of shares in a stallion, though they may get breedings as a maintenance fee for standing, taking care of mare bookings, caring for, advertising the stallion, etc. Rarely an owner will keep full or majority ownership of a stallion that goes to stud or more common is keeping a smaller percentage interest in the horse. For example, Stonestreet has the majority ownership in Curlin.

I remember when chrome was sold. Soo many people were pissed at Taylor made for the decision. In reality as you said..it was the SYNDICATE who opted to sell and Taylor made had little say

[Akitaperson]

Tom's de'tat left?

No he hasn't but given his numbers I won't be shocked if he and outwork are on the chopping block eventually

I agree about Outwork, he definitely made my list. I disagree about Tom's d'Etat at this point. His first crop is 2yos, that is why his RMB is low, plus he was a late bloomer himself. I think that was because he was plagued by injuries and issues but he didn't start racing until 3, didn't become a SW until 5, and a G1SW until 6 and raced at age 7. I'm not saying he won't move eventually because most new stallions will but they'll give him a year or two to see how his foals race. Given that they kept Always Dreaming and Good Samaritan until this year when their first crops were 4, makes me think they learned their lesson about moving on a stallion too early with Take Charge Indy and Daredevil. He got a nice winner at Saratoga a couple weeks ago in Strong State and is currently sitting higher on the Freshman sire list than their other 2 Freshman stallions.

I'm surprised though Dreaming even made it to there 2024 roster when his numbers in 2023 were so well pitiful