Stallions who might have been

[Slewfan2]

Slew o’ Gold had 6 G1 winners in his first two crops. If he’d not gotten sick, who knows what he’d have achieved

[mariasmon]

How about Rewilding? He was just getting really good when he broke down in the King George VI and Queen Elizabeth S., going for his 3rd straight G1. He was half to Dar Re Mi and others.

[sweettalk]

Slew o’ Gold had 6 G1 winners in his first two crops. If he’d not gotten sick, who knows what he’d have achieved

this is the first i'm learning abt him being sick enough to affect his stud career. what happened?

[Slewfan2]

Slew o’ Gold had 6 G1 winners in his first two crops. If he’d not gotten sick, who knows what he’d have achieved

this is the first i'm learning abt him being sick enough to affect his stud career. what happened?

I think it affected his career - at least I recall reading that. But now I’m not sure….I can’t find anything to say that it did.

So…oops?

[Akitaperson]

Slew o’ Gold had 6 G1 winners in his first two crops. If he’d not gotten sick, who knows what he’d have achieved

this is the first i'm learning abt him being sick enough to affect his stud career. what happened?

I think it affected his career - at least I recall reading that. But now I’m not sure….I can’t find anything to say that it did.

So…oops?

Maybe your thinking of the cushings and epm that ended his life?

[Slewfan2]

this is the first i'm learning abt him being sick enough to affect his stud career. what happened?

I think it affected his career - at least I recall reading that. But now I’m not sure….I can’t find anything to say that it did.

So…oops?

Maybe your thinking of the cushings and epm that ended his life?

I could be. I believe he got EPM in 1996, but by then he’d already had several crops of foals on the ground,

So, I guess he doesn’t really belong here, though it is odd how he started off so incredibly well and then hit a wall, pretty much except for Dramatic Gold

[Flanders]

Slew o’ Gold had 6 G1 winners in his first two crops. If he’d not gotten sick, who knows what he’d have achieved

this is the first i'm learning abt him being sick enough to affect his stud career. what happened?

I think it affected his career - at least I recall reading that. But now I’m not sure….I can’t find anything to say that it did.

So…oops?

I remember reading that theory on the internet alongtime ago and also believing it. I feel like I typed the story out on this forum before. But now with more information available online it can't be true unless he got it more than once? Can a horse get EPM more than once? I know they can relapse. Slew o' Gold went to stud in 1985. This article from a stallion groom/manager says here(its almost at the end of the article) that Slew o' Gold got EPM while the man being interviewed went to pick up Arazi to stand at Three Chimneys. Arazi only stood in the US one year, 1997, so that would mean fall 96. I confirmed that with this pdf from TDN that says Slew O' Gold got EPM in November 1996. So that is far removed from his start at stud. His stallion career always baffled me, he got 6 G1SWs in his first 2 crops and then 2 the rest of his career.

[Slewfan2]

this is the first i'm learning abt him being sick enough to affect his stud career. what happened?

I think it affected his career - at least I recall reading that. But now I’m not sure….I can’t find anything to say that it did.

So…oops?

I remember reading that theory on the internet alongtime ago and also believing it. I feel like I typed the story out on this forum before. But now with more information available online it can't be true. Slew o' Gold went to stud in 1985. This article from a stallion groom/manager says here(its almost at the end of the article) that Slew o' Gold got EPM while the man being interviewed went to pick up Arazi to stand at Three Chimneys. Arazi only stood in the US one year, 1997, so that would mean fall 96. I confirmed that with this pdf from TDN that says Slew O' Gold got EPM in November 1996. So that is far removed from his start at stud. His stallion career always baffled me, he got 6 G1SWs in his first 2 crops and then 2 the rest of his career.

Yep, because I found an article this am from TDN, and it was from November 1996.

Crazy - it makes me wonder if they bred him to different kinds of mares, which made a difference. Who knows? But man, the good horses he did get were good. Gorgeous was special, and so underrated

That article you linked to reminded me of another Indy who had so much promise as a race horse - Jump Start. He suffered a very serous injury, but ended up becoming a really solid sire. He was another who died too young.

[Flanders]

I think it affected his career - at least I recall reading that. But now I’m not sure….I can’t find anything to say that it did.

So…oops?

I remember reading that theory on the internet alongtime ago and also believing it. I feel like I typed the story out on this forum before. But now with more information available online it can't be true. Slew o' Gold went to stud in 1985. This article from a stallion groom/manager says here(its almost at the end of the article) that Slew o' Gold got EPM while the man being interviewed went to pick up Arazi to stand at Three Chimneys. Arazi only stood in the US one year, 1997, so that would mean fall 96. I confirmed that with this pdf from TDN that says Slew O' Gold got EPM in November 1996. So that is far removed from his start at stud. His stallion career always baffled me, he got 6 G1SWs in his first 2 crops and then 2 the rest of his career.

Yep, because I found an article this am from TDN, and it was from November 1996.

Crazy - it makes me wonder if they bred him to different kinds of mares, which made a difference. Who knows? But man, the good horses he did get were good. Gorgeous was special, and so underrated

That article you linked to reminded me of another Indy who had so much promise as a race horse - Jump Start. He suffered a very serous injury, but ended up becoming a really solid sire. He was another who died too young.

Jump Start moved to Pennsylvania because of the Overbrook dispersal. He did live to be 20, I mean sure that isn't super old but isn't young. A P Valentine who was a rare G1SWing 2yo by Indy, who finished 2nd in the Preakness and Belmont, was pretty much infertile. He only had one foal from his years in Kentucky. He did get some mares in foal in 2003 before being sent to a reproductive specialist in Texas in 2004. He didn't even sire 30 foals though, who knows what he could have been if he wasn't infertile.

[sweettalk]

Slew o’ Gold had 6 G1 winners in his first two crops. If he’d not gotten sick, who knows what he’d have achieved

this is the first i'm learning abt him being sick enough to affect his stud career. what happened?

I think it affected his career - at least I recall reading that. But now I’m not sure….I can’t find anything to say that it did.

So…oops?

i never even knew he was sick at all, let alone that he had EPM so don't feel bad!
definitely a very strange stud record.

[Slewfan2]

I remember reading that theory on the internet alongtime ago and also believing it. I feel like I typed the story out on this forum before. But now with more information available online it can't be true. Slew o' Gold went to stud in 1985. This article from a stallion groom/manager says here(its almost at the end of the article) that Slew o' Gold got EPM while the man being interviewed went to pick up Arazi to stand at Three Chimneys. Arazi only stood in the US one year, 1997, so that would mean fall 96. I confirmed that with this pdf from TDN that says Slew O' Gold got EPM in November 1996. So that is far removed from his start at stud. His stallion career always baffled me, he got 6 G1SWs in his first 2 crops and then 2 the rest of his career.

Yep, because I found an article this am from TDN, and it was from November 1996.

Crazy - it makes me wonder if they bred him to different kinds of mares, which made a difference. Who knows? But man, the good horses he did get were good. Gorgeous was special, and so underrated

That article you linked to reminded me of another Indy who had so much promise as a race horse - Jump Start. He suffered a very serous injury, but ended up becoming a really solid sire. He was another who died too young.

Jump Start moved to Pennsylvania because of the Overbrook dispersal. He did live to be 20, I mean sure that isn't super old but isn't young. A P Valentine who was a rare G1SWing 2yo by Indy, who finished 2nd in the Preakness and Belmont, was pretty much infertile. He only had one foal from his years in Kentucky. He did get some mares in foal in 2003 before being sent to a reproductive specialist in Texas in 2004. He didn't even sire 30 foals though, who knows what he could have been if he wasn't infertile.

Oh, I don’t know why I thought he was young…loved him, though, and was really sad when he passed.

APV was such a talented baby…I was going to say that he didn’t do much as a 3 year old, but I just checked - I forgot that he finished 2nd in the Preakness and Belmont

Such a shame he was infertile

[Nenikikamen23]

So my current list is probably:

- Arrogate; !!! He's blown away everyone's expectations to already become a "is the moment" stallion, but he could have achieved Unbridled's Song levels of success in my opinion
- Roaring Lion; He's had so much success already, shame he had so few foals. We could've seen so much more from him
- Wise Dan; I know everyone's considered once or twice what he could have been as a stallion lol
- Magnum Moon; I liked him as a racehorse, I like his female family well enough. Shame he passed so young
- Cave Rock; Any son of Arrogate, especially one with Cave Rock's ability, is a "what if" situation for me
- Shared Belief; Shame he was both gelded and never someone we got to see the full potential of. I quite like Candy Ride as a sire of sires
- Lancaster Bomber; He's doing really well from what he did sire, wish South Africa got to see more crops from him. He could have been their best War Front son
- Dullahan; I don't think he would have been a top class stallion, but I liked him as a racehorse
- Code of Honor; Loved him as a racehorse, beautiful animal that I wish we got to see more foals from. He had potential
- World Approval; Had he not been gelded, I think he would've been a great regional stallion somewhere
- Commando; Didn't he sire like 10 SWs from 27 foals? Could've been interesting to see further influence from him
- Domino; Pretty universal opinion here

- Anthony Van Dyck (IRE); I really liked his breeding, would have liked to see foals from him
- Farhh (GB); I love him as a stallion already, if he had better fertility he could be a much bigger name
- Cirrus des Aigles (FR); Not sure he'd have been a success, but I would have liked at least the chance to see. His durability and consistency is one of the most memorable in racing history
- Sole Power (GB); Not sure he'd have been a success, but I would have liked at least the chance to see

- Kementari (AUS); His subfertility left a lot of questions unanswered

- Leroidesanimaux (BRZ); I know he had several crops on the ground when he passed, but I don't think we'd seen the best of him yet
- Kukulkan (MEX); I would have liked to see his potential impact on North and Latin America breeding.

[Slewfan2]

this is the first i'm learning abt him being sick enough to affect his stud career. what happened?

I think it affected his career - at least I recall reading that. But now I’m not sure….I can’t find anything to say that it did.

So…oops?

i never even knew he was sick at all, let alone that he had EPM so don't feel bad!
definitely a very strange stud record.

Inexplicable.

Breeding really is an inexact science

[Northport]

this is the first i'm learning abt him being sick enough to affect his stud career. what happened?

I think it affected his career - at least I recall reading that. But now I’m not sure….I can’t find anything to say that it did.

So…oops?

I remember reading that theory on the internet alongtime ago and also believing it. I feel like I typed the story out on this forum before. But now with more information available online it can't be true unless he got it more than once? Can a horse get EPM more than once? I know they can relapse. Slew o' Gold went to stud in 1985. This article from a stallion groom/manager says here(its almost at the end of the article) that Slew o' Gold got EPM while the man being interviewed went to pick up Arazi to stand at Three Chimneys. Arazi only stood in the US one year, 1997, so that would mean fall 96. I confirmed that with this pdf from TDN that says Slew O' Gold got EPM in November 1996. So that is far removed from his start at stud. His stallion career always baffled me, he got 6 G1SWs in his first 2 crops and then 2 the rest of his career.

Horses can definitely exhibit symptoms of EPM over and over again. Whether a treatment completely cures it and they get it again or the treatment temporarily manages the symptoms before it comes back, I cannot say for certain. But we’ve had horses that we have battled EPM symptoms with on and off for years.

[stelladaniella]

Someone I was really having high hopes for, and followed for a long time was Last Cookie. He is by Bernardini o/o Fast Cookie, so half to Frosted. Was owned by Darley. Gelded now.
We contacted Darley with my mom and said, if he doesn't make it on the track or interest a ton of breeders to make a name for himself in Kentucky, we would be happy to buy him off them so he doesn't end up running in claimings/alw for the rest of his life. They said they'd keep us updated if it comes to that, but we never got the call before he was ultimately claimed and is now running in allowances. Such a royal pedigree, the last foal of Fast Cookie.

[Oasis Dream]

I would have loved to see what Indian Charlie would have continued producing, if he had had a longer career.

[Curtis]

i've never heard of Itsallgreektome. how come he had to be gelded because of a stall accident??

He was the Champion Turf Horse of 1990 and a lovely grey. If I remember right (this was alongtime ago), he got injured in like December 92. He broke his withers and the vet said he wouldn't ever be able to cover mares. they tried to bring him back to the races in 94 but he wasn't anywhere near the same horse. So they retired him and he lived out his life at Cardiff Stud until he had to be put down at 20.

I added some more horses to my list after you replied. hahaha

I’m all but positive that Itsallgreektome was gelded very early in his racing career, if not before it. The 1990 Del Mar Derby, cost me a nice P3. Tight Spot won the race but was DQ’d and Itsallgreektome was moved up from 2nd. At the time some of us were talking and theorized that Verne Winchell should just give up the difference in purse money and negotiated to keep the win since Tight Spot was a colt and ‘Greek’ lacked equipment. The DQ was later overturned in court and Tight Spot was reinstated as the winner. I’m still waiting for the CHRB to send me the check for my P3.

[Flanders]

i've never heard of Itsallgreektome. how come he had to be gelded because of a stall accident??

He was the Champion Turf Horse of 1990 and a lovely grey. If I remember right (this was alongtime ago), he got injured in like December 92. He broke his withers and the vet said he wouldn't ever be able to cover mares. they tried to bring him back to the races in 94 but he wasn't anywhere near the same horse. So they retired him and he lived out his life at Cardiff Stud until he had to be put down at 20.

I added some more horses to my list after you replied. hahaha

I’m all but positive that Itsallgreektome was gelded very early in his racing career, if not before it. The 1990 Del Mar Derby, cost me a nice P3. Tight Spot won the race but was DQ’d and Itsallgreektome was moved up from 2nd. At the time some of us were talking and theorized that Verne Winchell should just give up the difference in purse money and negotiated to keep the win since Tight Spot was a colt and ‘Greek’ lacked equipment. The DQ was later overturned in court and Tight Spot was reinstated as the winner. I’m still waiting for the CHRB to send me the check for my P3.

No you are right, I just looked and he is listed as a gelding in his races on Equibase in 91(the earliest it goes back to). I've believed that for what feels like forever to me. I remembered it because I liked him so much, I clearly remember reading that somewhere. 94 was the first year I subscribed to TB Times and I thought I read that in his retirement article. Perhaps it was a few years later in 96 when we got the internet and it was misinformation on some forum. I feel really dumb right now.

[Curtis]

He was the Champion Turf Horse of 1990 and a lovely grey. If I remember right (this was alongtime ago), he got injured in like December 92. He broke his withers and the vet said he wouldn't ever be able to cover mares. they tried to bring him back to the races in 94 but he wasn't anywhere near the same horse. So they retired him and he lived out his life at Cardiff Stud until he had to be put down at 20.

I added some more horses to my list after you replied. hahaha

I’m all but positive that Itsallgreektome was gelded very early in his racing career, if not before it. The 1990 Del Mar Derby, cost me a nice P3. Tight Spot won the race but was DQ’d and Itsallgreektome was moved up from 2nd. At the time some of us were talking and theorized that Verne Winchell should just give up the difference in purse money and negotiated to keep the win since Tight Spot was a colt and ‘Greek’ lacked equipment. The DQ was later overturned in court and Tight Spot was reinstated as the winner. I’m still waiting for the CHRB to send me the check for my P3.

No you are right, I just looked and he is listed as a gelding in his races on Equibase in 91(the earliest it goes back to). I've believed that for what feels like forever to me. I remembered it because I liked him so much, I clearly remember reading that somewhere. 94 was the first year I subscribed to TB Times and I thought I read that in his retirement article. Perhaps it was a few years later in 96 when we got the internet and it was misinformation on some forum. I feel really dumb right now.

As they say when legend becomes fact, print the legend. I like yours better. When he came back he was with Bob Hess Jr., and not Wally Dollase, I believe. I don’t know if the ownership was the same. Fortunately it was Hess Jr. who will pull the plug and take care of the horse and he wasn’t dropped into claimers. It’s always interesting when grays are off for an extended time. When they resurface, they’re almost white. Years ago there was a really nice stakes type by Spectacular Bid, Double Feint, who was away for 4 years. He was charcoal colored when he got hurt and white when he came back.

[Thumbsucker]

I wonder what The Chosen Vron could have done as a sire?