2024 Belmont Stakes at Saratoga

[HB1994]

Or maybe he's a turf horse?

Coolmore’s got plenty of turf stallions. They want to make SL their next big dirt sire.

But they have super sire Justify, who is a good dirt sire. I don’t think they need to worry

Justify may have run on the dirt, but his lone classic winner has come on the turf. 4 out of his 6 G1Ws have been on the turf. One BC winner on dirt, one on turf. He had zero impact on the American Triple Crown with his first two crops. I think the jury is still out on whether he’s a turf or dirt sire.

[tranquilo]

Miss Woodford, has there ever been a case of a Standardbred mare producing two classic winners in the same year? or for the QH racing savvy members, has an QH dam ever produced more than 1 classic/"big" race winner in the same foaling year?

Not sure about QH's, but Arabian 3 year old full-sisters RB Mary Lylah and RB Malexis won each division of the Lone Star Juvenile (G3) last year (with Mary Lylah beating the boys in her race). They also ran 1-2 in a couple stakes earlier this year.

[Squeaky]

I've seen virtually zero chatter about White Abarrio's "no-show" in yesterday's Met Mile. Does anybody here have any thoughts to share on that?

It's turning out to be one of the strangest careers so far that I recall in a while. He finishes 3rd in a stakes at Churchill Downs as a 2yo, then wins the GIII Holy Bull and the GI Florida Derby as the second choice on the board, all under trainer Saffie Joseph. Then Joseph is slapped with a "provisional" medication suspension by HISA/HIWU which causes White Abarrio to be taken away from him and given to Rick Dutrow, who happens to be early on the come-back trail off of a 10-year ban from the sport. Joseph's "provisional" suspension is then cleared after HISA/HIWU review which found no chargeable violation, but the damage is done.

Later that summer and fall, under his new trainer, the horse runs two hugely impressive GI races in the Whitney at Saratoga and the Breeders Cup Classic at Santa Anita. Then he remains at Santa Anita for about 3 months, openly using the historic racetrack as a training center to prepare for a run in the Saudi Cup in late February. He goes to Saudi Arabia with world-beater hype, particularly from his trainer, and proceeds to lay a huge egg in the race, finishing far up the track with no apparent excuse or reason.

He's then off until re-appearing in the Met Mile run this year at Saratoga and flops again as the slight favorite in the race, failing to hit the board.

I don't know what to think about this horse. This career path is just kind of bizarre. Anybody here have any thoughts or comments on who he is and where he might go from here. He doesn't have a very fashionable immediate pedigree, though his two grandsires are Tapit and Into Mischief. I'm just not sure, given his two major racing debacles most recently, that major farms are going to be knocking the door down to get to him.

Curiouser and curiouser!

Breaking news: Owners transferred WA back to Saffie now. To aim for John Nerud stakes in July.
So is WA going back to Gulfstream now? https://x.com/drfgrening/status/1799907 ... 57161?s=46

[brunanas]

Miss Woodford, has there ever been a case of a Standardbred mare producing two classic winners in the same year? or for the QH racing savvy members, has an QH dam ever produced more than 1 classic/"big" race winner in the same foaling year?

Not sure about QH's, but Arabian 3 year old full-sisters RB Mary Lylah and RB Malexis won each division of the Lone Star Juvenile (G3) last year (with Mary Lylah beating the boys in her race). They also ran 1-2 in a couple stakes earlier this year.

that's so cool! is there a limit on how many foals Arabian racing broodmares can have per year? tia

[MySaladDays]

If a farm exists that can correct paddling, I’m going to hit up Jayson Werth to get a loan and buy stock. That would be far more lucrative than buying horses.

Lets make a list of horses who were head cases, had crooked legs, and downright terrible conformations, who became notable champions. Both here and abroad.

Then let's compare how they were brought along......patiently. Not with quick last minute fixes and thrown into a race.

I think it was Jack van Berg who did wake up in his older years, "if you don't give them the time, they will MAKE YOU take the time."

You can make the list. Economics are different now. No one that I know of is going to pay 2.8M for a horse hoping he’ll make a good 5yo. Vekoma, from the same line without Gun Runner as the middle man, was a horrible mess. He got plenty of time off between 3 and 4 and he was still a mess. The body maturing would help, I agree, but I’m talking about the now. When Sierra Leone was purchased, the idea was win a Classic or some other notable G1 and then get a stallion deal. We can lament all we want but if an expensive horse doesn’t prove out by the middle of their 3yo season they’re culled and then it’s on to the next.

JVB’s daddy Marion may have said something similar but the “Wait on them or they’ll make you wait” quote was widely attributed to Charlie Whittingham. Charlie also mused about the resemblance of horses to strawberries. It’s an inexact science.

Plenty of horses making big $ as 4 and 5 year olds. Just not here. In the u.s. we are lucky if a horse is still on the track after 3. Guess that is why handle in japan is 2x what it was here last year...double. they love to wager, but into a model with transparency, etc.

"On to the next" does not create longer term fans. Either does "What figure did he run" which trevor denman knew back in 2015 and talked about in interviews. Of cousehe owned horses in so africa and even back then there was a higher level of horse welfare there and in britain that we are just catching up with now. When he arrived here back in the day he was baffled that we didnt have tons of horse rescues...he was in the vanguard and trying to explain these things.

Meanwhile Vekoma is rolling right along with six first-crop winners to date and leads all freshman sires by progeny earnings as well.