Pedigree Talk

[Oasis Dream]

Being a pedigree person, I had to look up those stallions listed as "bad stallions". I've never heard of any of them before, I mean King of Kings sounded familiar and I guarantee I've seen his name before since he is Exclusive Native's 1/2 brother but I was more familiar with the MG1SW with the same name by Sadler's Wells. Exploding must have been super bad because pedigreequery doesn't even have any foals listed by him.

I wonder how much the rising value of land in California has contributed to the drop off in foal crop there or if it was more the factor of the pre-bloodstock burst hype and too many people lost money or just a combination. I'm using JC stats here but in 1991(this is the earliest) California(753) and Texas(579) both had more stallions than stood in Kentucky(499). Texas didn't even have that many live foals born in 2021(the last year they have data for).

This data is 1991-2021 and can look at individual years:
Foal crops by state: https://www.jockeyclub.com/default.asp? ... =FB&area=4
Stallions/mares bred by state: https://www.jockeyclub.com/default.asp? ... =FB&area=3

Since 1991 its kind of wild to see that mares serviced in Kentucky has actually gone up. While everywhere else has gone down significantly. Kentucky only produced 19% of the US foal crop in 1991 while in 2021 they produced 44.8%. If I look at my collection of stallion directories, there is a very noticeable difference of during the bloodstock bubble and after the bloodstock bubble burst. The stallions directories were twice as big before. Like I said in the other thread, Gainesway had 46 stallions in 1982.

I think a combination of cashing-in on skyrocketing land value with non-turbulent weather along with trying to catch the next best thing stud-wise were the two main factors of CA's industry decline. Studs like *Khaled, *Beau Pere, *Alibhai, T.V. Lark, Fleet Nasrullah, Gummo, In Excess (IRE), Pirate's Bounty, Naevus, Flying Paster, Bertrando, and Unusual Heat were either keystones to the overall breed itself (I consider *Beau Pere to be #1) and/or significant regional boosts for California. I noticed several family-owned farms dissolved their business when their grandparents or parents died, too. The current generation seems to not be interested in continuing on the business, and I don't blame them one bit.

The advent of breeding 100+ mares to the trending sires is really destroying the small farms off. I'm sickened that the Jockey Club backed down from trying to do the right thing to prevent oversaturation of bloodlines. I think it is already too late. This year's projected foal crop total will match to nearly 1965's total. Try to find an outcross that doesn't contain Storm Cat, A.P. Indy, Into Mischief, Tapit, Mr. Prospector, Northern Dancer, or Giant's Causeway. I believe Mizzen Mast one of the few examples of being a complete outcross, and it is too bad he is pensioned. With the market flooded with about five or so trending sires, a shrinking horse population, and revolving door of selling the top mares to overseas farms... we are screwed. Too bad the sheet avarice from the obvious farms are too myopic to see what is happening.

I keep wanting to "like," this post, but forget that I can't.
I believe you're right, on all counts.

[HB1994]

I’m a little surprised to see a Derby winner sired by Goldencents, but Mystik Dan definitely has some stout stamina influences on his dam’s side (Colonel John, Turkoman, Pleasant Colony, etc.).

[Izvestia]

I’m a little surprised to see a Derby winner sired by Goldencents, but Mystik Dan definitely has some stout stamina influences on his dam’s side (Colonel John, Turkoman, Pleasant Colony, etc.).

And Siphon! Very CA-raced pedigree.

[Mylute]

I was taken with a colt by Good Magic o/o Mellonbrook (Discreet Cat) who recently sold for $525K at Fasig-Tipton.

Lots of "who?" on his mother's side. His great-granddam is G1W Sharp Dance, who is by Dancing Czar, an unraced son of Nijinsky and MG1W Mrs. Warren.

Sharp Dance's dam is Sharp Nurse, a daughter of stallion Piercer. This son of Needles won once in 11 starts. Piercer's pedigree also has "who?" on his mom's side.

Beyond this, there are more recognizable names.

[HB1994]

Big Brown’s AEI as a broodmare sire is 1.11. Good Magic’s sire AEI is 1.99. The AEI for the cross of Good Magic over Big Brown mares? 52.48!

[stelladaniella]

I was browsing (as I often do, mindlessly) and landed on a horse named Eclipticalspraline. He stands for $1,500 in MD where he covered 12 mares last year, and he is a grandson of Exclusive Native. His sire, Ecliptical, who was foaled 1982, is a son of Exclusive Native. I don't know why, but that blew my mind, I did not think there would be a horse active at stud that closely related to any of the "Natives". I love Native Dancer and everything he's ever produced, sons, grandsons, daughters, etc, so it made me quite cheery
Even more mindblowing is that Ecliptical is not of Exclusive Natives last crop. His last crop was of 1984. I thought at first (this must be some type of last crop by last crop thing", but no!

Are there any other grandsons of Exclusive Native at stud?

[Flanders]

I was browsing (as I often do, mindlessly) and landed on a horse named Eclipticalspraline. He stands for $1,500 in MD where he covered 12 mares last year, and he is a grandson of Exclusive Native. His sire, Ecliptical, who was foaled 1982, is a son of Exclusive Native. I don't know why, but that blew my mind, I did not think there would be a horse active at stud that closely related to any of the "Natives". I love Native Dancer and everything he's ever produced, sons, grandsons, daughters, etc, so it made me quite cheery
Even more mindblowing is that Ecliptical is not of Exclusive Natives last crop. His last crop was of 1984. I thought at first (this must be some type of last crop by last crop thing", but no!

Are there any other grandsons of Exclusive Native at stud?

So its hard to know with regional stallions or other countries. He is the only male line descendant of Exclusive Native that is advertised in BH Stallion Directory. Bloodhorse has a PDF that shows advertised stallions by male line(2023): https://cdn.bloodhorse.com/Downloads/sp ... 983312.pdf

[stelladaniella]

I was browsing (as I often do, mindlessly) and landed on a horse named Eclipticalspraline. He stands for $1,500 in MD where he covered 12 mares last year, and he is a grandson of Exclusive Native. His sire, Ecliptical, who was foaled 1982, is a son of Exclusive Native. I don't know why, but that blew my mind, I did not think there would be a horse active at stud that closely related to any of the "Natives". I love Native Dancer and everything he's ever produced, sons, grandsons, daughters, etc, so it made me quite cheery
Even more mindblowing is that Ecliptical is not of Exclusive Natives last crop. His last crop was of 1984. I thought at first (this must be some type of last crop by last crop thing", but no!

Are there any other grandsons of Exclusive Native at stud?

So its hard to know with regional stallions or other countries. He is the only male line descendant of Exclusive Native that is advertised in BH Stallion Directory. Bloodhorse has a PDF that shows advertised stallions by male line(2023): https://cdn.bloodhorse.com/Downloads/sp ... 983312.pdf

That's pretty cool. Oh how I wish the Natives were still present appearance-wise. Raise A Native was a handsome guy.

[Flanders]

I was browsing (as I often do, mindlessly) and landed on a horse named Eclipticalspraline. He stands for $1,500 in MD where he covered 12 mares last year, and he is a grandson of Exclusive Native. His sire, Ecliptical, who was foaled 1982, is a son of Exclusive Native. I don't know why, but that blew my mind, I did not think there would be a horse active at stud that closely related to any of the "Natives". I love Native Dancer and everything he's ever produced, sons, grandsons, daughters, etc, so it made me quite cheery
Even more mindblowing is that Ecliptical is not of Exclusive Natives last crop. His last crop was of 1984. I thought at first (this must be some type of last crop by last crop thing", but no!

Are there any other grandsons of Exclusive Native at stud?

So its hard to know with regional stallions or other countries. He is the only male line descendant of Exclusive Native that is advertised in BH Stallion Directory. Bloodhorse has a PDF that shows advertised stallions by male line(2023): https://cdn.bloodhorse.com/Downloads/sp ... 983312.pdf

That's pretty cool. Oh how I wish the Natives were still present appearance-wise. Raise A Native was a handsome guy.

I just remembered the JC has a pretty neat search in their fact book. The newest data is 2021 but you can click on sire generation and then search for whoever. Then it will show how many foals from that stallion's male descendants were registered with the JC that year. Eclipticalspraline was the only representative of the Exclusive Native line at least in the first 5 generations.
https://jockeyclub.com/default.asp?sect ... es&area=21

Its kind of a puzzle game to try and figure out the really odd ones that don't have many foals.

[stelladaniella]

So its hard to know with regional stallions or other countries. He is the only male line descendant of Exclusive Native that is advertised in BH Stallion Directory. Bloodhorse has a PDF that shows advertised stallions by male line(2023): https://cdn.bloodhorse.com/Downloads/sp ... 983312.pdf

That's pretty cool. Oh how I wish the Natives were still present appearance-wise. Raise A Native was a handsome guy.

I just remembered the JC has a pretty neat search in their fact book. The newest data is 2021 but you can click on sire generation and then search for whoever. Then it will show how many foals from that stallion's male descendants were registered with the JC that year. Eclipticalspraline was the only representative of the Exclusive Native line at least in the first 5 generations.
https://jockeyclub.com/default.asp?sect ... es&area=21

Its kind of a puzzle game to try and figure out the really odd ones that don't have many foals.

You just gave me something to do this evening.

[Gemini]

Big Brown’s AEI as a broodmare sire is 1.11. Good Magic’s sire AEI is 1.99. The AEI for the cross of Good Magic over Big Brown mares? 52.48!

That’s more a testament to Puca than anything else.

[Mylute]

Kingsbarns has a maternal great-great-grandfather named Unpredictable (by Tri Jet). Won the 1982 San Vicente (G3) and stood in California and Canada.

And he has a maternal great-great-great-grandfather named Aurelius (by Grass Court) who won the Longacres Mile and several races in Argentina. He was born in Argentina. Stood in Washington.