Breeders Cup 2021 @ Del Mar

[stark]

Irad Ortiz Jr. will ride Tripoli in Breeders' Cup Classic, Sadler says

.
@iradortiz became available when Dr Post and Happy Saver, @PletcherRacing trainees he could have ridden, were removed from consideration for the Classic.

[Missbeholder]

Brad Pegram also said over the radio this weekend that Flavien Prat will ride Domestic Spending in the Turf for Chad Brown, so Mandella's going to have to find a new rider for United.

I don't think that surprises a lot of people, least of all Richard. I'm sure he saw that coming a mile away. You can't help but think that it makes him feel a little.....I don't know.....sad? Flavien started out being pretty much all his, and now he's having to share him with the rest of the world.

Can't be an easy thing.

[Ridan_Remembered]

Hi everyone. I finally found this forum again after it disappeared under its old name. So I'd like to reintroduce myself to the board by posting THE feel-good story of the year in Thoroughbred racing: 'Breeders’ Cup Presents Connections: Everything Going To Plan For Leonard And California Angel'

https://www.paulickreport.com/features/ ... XmOhBh2zGI

[tachyon]

-- from bloodhorse

''Japanese Breeders' Cup Delegation Expands to Seven'' . . . . . . . . . . . . .. . . . .. . . ..

https://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing ... s-to-seven

[Ridan_Remembered]

-- from bloodhorse

''Japanese Breeders' Cup Delegation Expands to Seven'' . . . . . . . . . . . . .. . . . .. . . ..

https://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing ... s-to-seven

Good news, Tachyon.

[Squeaky]

Maxfield will skip BC Classic and point for Clark instead as per HRN.

[KatieK101]

Maxfield will skip BC Classic and point for Clark instead as per HRN.

Am I the only one who didn't see this decision coming? I wasn't convinced they would run him in the Classic, but I did expect one of the BC races.

Welcome back, Ridan!

[BaroqueAgain1]

Nope. Me, too.
Welcome back, RR!

[Slewfan2]

Maxfield will skip BC Classic and point for Clark instead as per HRN.

For 3 million dollars, I would have taken a chance at the Classic. I get that winning a G1 is a big deal, but let’s say Maxfield does win the Clark, is it really going to make a huge difference in how breeders look at him? Wouldn’t a big performance in the Classic mean more ?

[thinair]

Maxfield will skip BC Classic and point for Clark instead as per HRN.

Figured they might try the BC Dirt Mile over the Classic but I guess they didn't want to take on Life Is Good. Not so sure it will be much easier beating Midnight Bourbon in the Clark.

[CorridorZ75]

Maxfield will skip BC Classic and point for Clark instead as per HRN.

Figured they might try the BC Dirt Mile over the Classic but I guess they didn't want to take on Life Is Good. Not so sure it will be much easier beating Midnight Bourbon in the Clark.

And this is why they need to slash the Grade 1 stakes by at least half. If you don’t think you have a grade 1 horse to compete in the BC, why should you be rewarded by skipping it with a grade 1 prize. However, the sales ring rules all in racing these days. Honestly, it is really the only thing horse racing has left of its “glamour” to attract the big money.
The whales used to show off their money with prestigious racing records of homebreds. Now they do it with overpaying for unraced horses and stallions and have left the racing to needle trainers and computer aided betting groups. In the modern era where animals are considered living beings just about everywhere else, horses in racing are even more just a commodity.

[Mylute]

ow the edge

[Squeaky]

Maxfield will skip BC Classic and point for Clark instead as per HRN.

Figured they might try the BC Dirt Mile over the Classic but I guess they didn't want to take on Life Is Good. Not so sure it will be much easier beating Midnight Bourbon in the Clark.

And this is why they need to slash the Grade 1 stakes by at least half. If you don’t think you have a grade 1 horse to compete in the BC, why should you be rewarded by skipping it with a grade 1 prize. However, the sales ring rules all in racing these days. Honestly, it is really the only thing horse racing has left of its “glamour” to attract the big money.
The whales used to show off their money with prestigious racing records of homebreds. Now they do it with overpaying for unraced horses and stallions and have left the racing to needle trainers and computer aided betting groups. In the modern era where animals are considered living beings just about everywhere else, horses in racing are even more just a commodity.

Sadly I agree with you. Is all about pinhooking and “ making a stallion”. Racing very much secondary.

[Ridan_Remembered]

Maxfield will skip BC Classic and point for Clark instead as per HRN.

Am I the only one who didn't see this decision coming? I wasn't convinced they would run him in the Classic, but I did expect one of the BC races.

Welcome back, Ridan!

Thanks Katiek and BaroqueAgain1.

[thinair]

Maxfield will skip BC Classic and point for Clark instead as per HRN.

Figured they might try the BC Dirt Mile over the Classic but I guess they didn't want to take on Life Is Good. Not so sure it will be much easier beating Midnight Bourbon in the Clark.

And this is why they need to slash the Grade 1 stakes by at least half. If you don’t think you have a grade 1 horse to compete in the BC, why should you be rewarded by skipping it with a grade 1 prize. However, the sales ring rules all in racing these days. Honestly, it is really the only thing horse racing has left of its “glamour” to attract the big money.
The whales used to show off their money with prestigious racing records of homebreds. Now they do it with overpaying for unraced horses and stallions and have left the racing to needle trainers and computer aided betting groups. In the modern era where animals are considered living beings just about everywhere else, horses in racing are even more just a commodity.

While I appreciate a good rant, not sure what CAW groups have to do with this.

[Tessablue]

Sort of torn on this one- I think devaluing the BC would be good for the sport, but I do like watching the best horses run against each other.

That being said, I'm not so sure Maxfield would have been competitive here, and it sounds like his connections know it. Should be a good matchup against Midnight Bourbon in the Clark.

[CorridorZ75]

Figured they might try the BC Dirt Mile over the Classic but I guess they didn't want to take on Life Is Good. Not so sure it will be much easier beating Midnight Bourbon in the Clark.

And this is why they need to slash the Grade 1 stakes by at least half. If you don’t think you have a grade 1 horse to compete in the BC, why should you be rewarded by skipping it with a grade 1 prize. However, the sales ring rules all in racing these days. Honestly, it is really the only thing horse racing has left of its “glamour” to attract the big money.
The whales used to show off their money with prestigious racing records of homebreds. Now they do it with overpaying for unraced horses and stallions and have left the racing to needle trainers and computer aided betting groups. In the modern era where animals are considered living beings just about everywhere else, horses in racing are even more just a commodity.

While I appreciate a good rant, not sure what CAW groups have to do with this.

If apparently a majority of the betting handle is generated by a computer, why should anyone in racing worry about losing handle due to optics or cheating scandals when the algorithm certainly doesn't care why a trainer has a great win percentage and moves up horses in certain situations? They just factor the effectiveness of the PED into their numbers.

[thinair]

If apparently a majority of the betting handle is generated by a computer, why should anyone in racing worry about losing handle due to optics or cheating scandals when the algorithm certainly doesn't care why a trainer has a great win percentage and moves up horses in certain situations? They just factor the effectiveness of the PED into their numbers.

Apparently? I'm not sure where you are getting your numbers but certainly the "majority of the betting handle" is not being derived from CAW play. The numbers may be exceedingly high elsewhere, though nowhere is it the majority, but in NY it's around 15%.

[CorridorZ75]

If apparently a majority of the betting handle is generated by a computer, why should anyone in racing worry about losing handle due to optics or cheating scandals when the algorithm certainly doesn't care why a trainer has a great win percentage and moves up horses in certain situations? They just factor the effectiveness of the PED into their numbers.

Apparently? I'm not sure where you are getting your numbers but certainly the "majority of the betting handle" is not being derived from CAW play. The numbers may be exceedingly high elsewhere, though nowhere is it the majority, but in NY it's around 15%.

https://racingthinktank.com/reports/tif ... only-elite
This is what I was thinking of, but you are right, I misremembered- the figure is supposedly a little more or a little less than 30%. However, if these groups are doing a lot of the winning, that means the recreational bettor is doing a lot of the losing. Since most young sports bettors are going to be more inclined and set up to go the CAW route than the older population that is literally gradually dying out, the percentages will only rise wouldn't they? At least until the critical point is met where too much "smart" money in the pools means the margins are too slim to make it worth it.

[thinair]

If apparently a majority of the betting handle is generated by a computer, why should anyone in racing worry about losing handle due to optics or cheating scandals when the algorithm certainly doesn't care why a trainer has a great win percentage and moves up horses in certain situations? They just factor the effectiveness of the PED into their numbers.

Apparently? I'm not sure where you are getting your numbers but certainly the "majority of the betting handle" is not being derived from CAW play. The numbers may be exceedingly high elsewhere, though nowhere is it the majority, but in NY it's around 15%.

https://racingthinktank.com/reports/tif ... only-elite
This is what I was thinking of, but you are right, I misremembered- the figure is supposedly a little more or a little less than 30%. However, if these groups are doing a lot of the winning, that means the recreational bettor is doing a lot of the losing. Since most young sports bettors are going to be more inclined and set up to go the CAW route than the older population that is literally gradually dying out, the percentages will only rise wouldn't they? At least until the critical point is met where too much "smart" money in the pools means the margins are too slim to make it worth it.

I think you have some misunderstanding about what CAW play is. It's highly sophisticated computer algorithms. I don't think "most young sports bettors" will be going the "CAW route." I don't see the two situations as even reasonably analogous. What the future of CAW play in horse racing will be is difficult to guess. If I had to bet on it, I would say it figures to go down going forward, and would be very surprised if it increases. That's just my opinion. We put some restrictions on their play in the WPS this Summer at NYRA and it resulted in them leaving those pools. I have no idea if others will follow this route.

CAW players are not winning, in as much as their wagering doesn't return 100% of the dollars wagered. They are losing less than their rebate. That's how they are winning. Of course that's how the vast majority of remaining winning players win. Nothing wrong with that, per se, just an explanation. The problem, of course, are tracks which have substantial CAW play, and if they are losing say 5%, they are still beating the takeout by roughly 15%, and thus raising effective takeout for regular players. This is the basic problem. It's grinding players out at a higher rate.