Bend Or & Tadcaster

bare it all · Tue Apr 11, 2017 1:42 pm

What an interesting rabbit hole to go down for anyone who enjoys such things. Old news for some as the data is 10+ years old now, but I just happened down the hole...

The horse we call Bend Or (Doncaster o/o Rouge Rose) was actually another colt named Tadcaster (Doncaster o/o Clemence). Of course, this was using DNA 100+ years after the fact and nothing is for sure... but it sure does make pedigrees interesting.

Insane Crazy · Tue Apr 11, 2017 1:45 pm

Neat! Do you have any resources for reading up on this? And do you mean that Tadcaster was running as Bend Or, or is this just after the fact?

And which one had the spots?

bare it all · Tue Apr 11, 2017 1:53 pm

Insane Crazy wrote:Neat! Do you have any resources for reading up on this? And do you mean that Tadcaster was running as Bend Or, or is this just after the fact?

And which one had the spots?

I found some random note and then did some googling... it appears that sometime in the yearling phase the two colts were swapped.

http://www.americanclassicpedigrees.com ... nd-or.html

http://cs.bloodhorse.com/blogs/truenick ... nd-or.aspx

Ha, about that spots.. Bend Or (presumably 'Tadcaster' o/o Clemence) had the spots. Oddly, the sire of Rouge Rose (Thormanby) had the same spots. It's also been mentioned that the mare Sandiway (Doncaster o/o Clemence, who would be a full sister to whoever is Tadcaster) also had some spots like the ones what we know as "Bend Or" had.

Point Given · Wed Apr 12, 2017 9:45 am

This is fascinating! So according to pedigree query, Clemence was later bred to Bend Or http://www.pedigreequery.com/lenity

bare it all · Wed Apr 12, 2017 1:01 pm

Point Given wrote:This is fascinating! So according to pedigree query, Clemence was later bred to Bend Or http://www.pedigreequery.com/lenity

Correct... she was bred to Bend Or aka Tadcaster. her son. Some say by the Duke as a way to say "well see, we KNOW he's o/o Rouge Rose because how silly would it be to breed the dam to her son! No one would do that knowingly!"

I mean, none of this changes anything at all in today's day as these horses are so far back in generations it doesn't matter. But it does make for interesting reading. I truly wonder how many other horses back in the "old days" this is actually true of. We see this today with horses getting mixed up and ran as the other. I imagine there are dozens of inaccurate pedigrees and we just don't know it.

aethervox · Wed Apr 12, 2017 7:47 pm

There's a page about historic pedigrees and genetics at http://www.tbheritage.com/GenMarkers.html that has a link to one of the first papers that looked at mitochondrial DNA (passed from mother to all offspring) and female families. It's quite fascinating.