Stallion News

[Mel Mae]

If people didn't breed to them, then maybe they wouldn't do this. They are not in the racing industry, they are in the breeding industry. Very different worlds, apparently.
Unless the horse is a cripple and can't stay sound, what really IS the point? Oh wait, I guess a lot of these precocious 2-year-olds don't train on at 3 (or 4), so rather than have them disappear from the headlines, this is probably the best way to ensure interest remains in the horse. Essentially they will produce something precocious like themselves that cannot train on.

I was told something by a breed-to-race breeder that stuck with me a few years ago ... "This sport has gone from breeding to get the best racehorse to racing to get the biggest ATM stallion."

[Admin]

??

He entered stud in Florida, and stood this year for $5,000. I don't really remember his racetrack exploits, but don't recall him retiring at 2 either (and of course, not to much demand when he did).

As for him moving to KY, it appears to be as a favor to the owner, similar to them standing her maiden winner.

He bred 115 mares in FL in 2015 and I would guess he got as many or more this year. He's the #2 sire in FL behind the deceased Wildcat Heir. I don't think there was any need to move him to KY unless they thought there would be enough demand for him. He retired in August of his 2YO year with an injury.[/quote]

I guess I wasn't clear. I meant demand as a stallion prospect. A stallion who never broke his maiden can get hot if he turns out to be a good stallion. But as a stallion prospect, a G2 win usually gets you what it got Kantharos -- a home in a secondary market at a low stud fee.

Regarding why he's moving up here, I'd think it's a large part favor. He may be 2nd in FL this year, but as Dustin used to say, that's like being the skinniest kid at Fat Camp. He's #62 nationally. He was 8th in FL last year, and 16th in his crop. His yearling average last year was $26k, and it's down to $18k this year. I can't see this as a move due to his overwhelming success.

[mariasmon]

I guess I wasn't clear. I meant demand as a stallion prospect. A stallion who never broke his maiden can get hot if he turns out to be a good stallion. But as a stallion prospect, a G2 win usually gets you what it got Kantharos -- a home in a secondary market at a low stud fee.

Regarding why he's moving up here, I'd think it's a large part favor. He may be 2nd in FL this year, but as Dustin used to say, that's like being the skinniest kid at Fat Camp. He's #62 nationally. He was 8th in FL last year, and 16th in his crop. His yearling average last year was $26k, and it's down to $18k this year. I can't see this as a move due to his overwhelming success.

I can't see the logic in relocating him when he is a success in Florida, unless they believe he'll be well-supported in Kentucky and not just by Stonestreet. His position on the general sires list is irrelevant to me right now. He's a third-crop sire who's been based in Florida and servicing Florida mares. Comparing him to stallions who have more than 3 crops racing and have stood in Kentucky the whole time isn't really fair at this stage.

[Northport]

Well, I don't agree with it but he'll have made eight starts by the time he's done. More than some three and four year olds lol. Two year old fillies being covered is just as bad. Completely off topic but coolmore retiring all their 3yos irritates me as well.

I suppose that makes it somewhat better but if I were a mare owner I'd want to know how he performed at 3 and 4 or older. As a mare owner I want to know - was he just precociously brilliant as a 2yo, but then would tank at 3?
I mean there's got to be some benefit to showcasing durability and not peaking too early. I realize a lot of buyers WANT to have runners who can hit the track at 2 and start returning on their investment, but wouldn't you also want to maximize that as a buyer by having a horse who can run for a long time too? Idk maybe that's just me

It's interesting that they're retiring despite winning just a single G2. I'd have to believe something is wrong with him or otherwise the public isn't being given the truth behind why he's retiring.

Is there really a big market for a G2-winning 2yo? Good luck to them but I wouldn't be interested.

I would believe that something was seriously wrong with him if they weren't planning to race him in the Middle Park later this month

[Admin]

I guess I wasn't clear. I meant demand as a stallion prospect. A stallion who never broke his maiden can get hot if he turns out to be a good stallion. But as a stallion prospect, a G2 win usually gets you what it got Kantharos -- a home in a secondary market at a low stud fee.

Regarding why he's moving up here, I'd think it's a large part favor. He may be 2nd in FL this year, but as Dustin used to say, that's like being the skinniest kid at Fat Camp. He's #62 nationally. He was 8th in FL last year, and 16th in his crop. His yearling average last year was $26k, and it's down to $18k this year. I can't see this as a move due to his overwhelming success.

I can't see the logic in relocating him when he is a success in Florida, unless they believe he'll be well-supported in Kentucky and not just by Stonestreet. His position on the general sires list is irrelevant to me right now. He's a third-crop sire who's been based in Florida and servicing Florida mares. Comparing him to stallions who have more than 3 crops racing and have stood in Kentucky the whole time isn't really fair at this stage.

The floor fell out from below the Florida market this year. A lot of people are talking about it after the OBS sale.

Maybe he'll get a nice-sized book in KY, but i still think part of the motivatin is the relationship between Sikura and Stonestreet.

[Mel Mae]

I would believe that something was seriously wrong with him if they weren't planning to race him in the Middle Park later this month

Agreed, plus how often he was raced this summer (yes, yes, things can happen at any time but there must not be anything too wrong if they are continuing to race him without a large break - his last race was last Sunday (9/11) and he's running in the Middle Park off 13 days rest). He raced five times between May 5 and July 7 with three of those coming in May. Maybe he's not showing signs of training on or someone through a pile of money at them to retire him at the end of this year (doubtful).

[Admin]

Northport, that does seem logical but it could be something that will inevitably catch up with him but isn't an immediate threat. A throat/breathing problem, for example. There are also occasions where some will run once or twice more, even when they know they shouldn't.

[lurkey mclurker]

Rulership(JPN), 2007H. King Kamehameha(JPN) x Air Groove(JPN) by Tony Bin(IRE), covered 280 mares -- record number in Japan-- in 2016.


standing at Shadai Stallion Station

http://www.jbis.jp/horse/0001042049/

I wouldn't mind Azeri going to Rulership, that's one way to get the King Kamehameha line.

[BaroqueAgain1]

Cacique, a dual Grade 1 winner and full brother to stallions Dansili and Champs Elysees, has been retired from stud duty by Juddmonte Farm.
The 15-year-old son of Danehill dealt with subfertility throughout his stud career, and as a result, had limited books of mares and small crops of foals. In spite of that, Cacique sired several talented runners including Group/Grade 1 winners Slumber, Mutual Trust, and Dominant.
Cacique was one of five Group/Grade 1 winners produced from the blue hen mare, Hasili. Cacique began his career in Europe, and was transferred to North America to campaign at age five. While trained by Bobby Frankel in the U.S., Cacique notched victories in the G1 Man o' War and G1 Manhattan, and was second in the G1 Arlington Million, G1 Woodford Reserve Turf Classic, and G1 United Nations.
Read More: http://www.paulickreport.com/news/blood ... stud-duty/

[BaroqueAgain1]

The Gurkha has been retired after surgery for a displaced colon.
http://www.racingpost.com/news/horse-ra ... t7DaysNews

The Galileo colt was clearly talented, but...IIRC, he had a setback last year due to colic. If this horse has had recurring problems with his intestinal tract, is that something that can be inherited? Or is it one of those why-was-that-designed-that-way? things about horses that we just have to accept?

[BlindLucky]

Cacique, a dual Grade 1 winner and full brother to stallions Dansili and Champs Elysees, has been retired from stud duty by Juddmonte Farm.
The 15-year-old son of Danehill dealt with subfertility throughout his stud career, and as a result, had limited books of mares and small crops of foals. In spite of that, Cacique sired several talented runners including Group/Grade 1 winners Slumber, Mutual Trust, and Dominant.
Cacique was one of five Group/Grade 1 winners produced from the blue hen mare, Hasili. Cacique began his career in Europe, and was transferred to North America to campaign at age five. While trained by Bobby Frankel in the U.S., Cacique notched victories in the G1 Man o' War and G1 Manhattan, and was second in the G1 Arlington Million, G1 Woodford Reserve Turf Classic, and G1 United Nations.
Read More: http://www.paulickreport.com/news/blood ... stud-duty/

That sucks. Slumber is one of the more physically impressive horses I've seen lately, you can pick his big bay butt out of a crowd of big bay butts

I don't know that I've seen any Cacique offspring here in the US other than Slumber, but would love to know if that's the norm for his other runners. Big, strong, and bone that goes on for days.

[mariasmon]

Cacique is really good looking, himself. In the paddock before the Arlington Million, he looked like a man among boys. He finished 2nd to The Tin Man, who never looked like a man among boys (although he was quite pretty)

[BaroqueAgain1]

I'm pulling for his bro, Champs Elysees, to carry on Hasili's outstanding genes.

[Mel Mae]

The Gurkha has been retired after surgery for a displaced colon.
http://www.racingpost.com/news/horse-ra ... t7DaysNews

The Galileo colt was clearly talented, but...IIRC, he had a setback last year due to colic. If this horse has had recurring problems with his intestinal tract, is that something that can be inherited? Or is it one of those why-was-that-designed-that-way? things about horses that we just have to accept?

There are other chronic colickers out there breeding who don't seem to pass it on so I think it's more of the "why was he designed that way" thing in many cases (of course, there's always the exceptions to the rule but hopefully he's not one of those). He was extremely talented. It's disappointing that health issues ended his career so early, at least he got a classic victory on his resume during that time.

[BaroqueAgain1]

I wonder if Coolmore is going to run out of room for all those Galileo sons that they're standing?

[Mel Mae]

That's what their National Hunt divisions are for, haha. Not good enough for the main farm and won at 1 1/2 miles or more? You get a nice stall at Grange or Beeches. They only have three Galileos between those two farms, plenty of room for even more!

[Retrospectiv]

Cacique, a dual Grade 1 winner and full brother to stallions Dansili and Champs Elysees, has been retired from stud duty by Juddmonte Farm.
The 15-year-old son of Danehill dealt with subfertility throughout his stud career, and as a result, had limited books of mares and small crops of foals. In spite of that, Cacique sired several talented runners including Group/Grade 1 winners Slumber, Mutual Trust, and Dominant.
Cacique was one of five Group/Grade 1 winners produced from the blue hen mare, Hasili. Cacique began his career in Europe, and was transferred to North America to campaign at age five. While trained by Bobby Frankel in the U.S., Cacique notched victories in the G1 Man o' War and G1 Manhattan, and was second in the G1 Arlington Million, G1 Woodford Reserve Turf Classic, and G1 United Nations.
Read More: http://www.paulickreport.com/news/blood ... stud-duty/

That sucks. Slumber is one of the more physically impressive horses I've seen lately, you can pick his big bay butt out of a crowd of big bay butts

I don't know that I've seen any Cacique offspring here in the US other than Slumber, but would love to know if that's the norm for his other runners. Big, strong, and bone that goes on for days.

The Racing Post article noted that Slumber will be standing at Calumet starting in 2017

[BlindLucky]

The Racing Post article noted that Slumber will be standing at Calumet starting in 2017

I look forward to the conformation shot

[Northport]

I'm pulling for his bro, Champs Elysees, to carry on Hasili's outstanding genes.

I think Dansili is doing a pretty good job at representing the family

[Sparrow Castle]

Nicole Russo ‏@DRFRusso
... and here's two-time BC Dirt Mile winner Goldencents, who has filled out to look a lot like sire Into Mischief