BlindLucky wrote:Flanders wrote:
He has to be chestnut. He hasn't, to my knowledge, sired any bays out of anything but bay mares.
He's sired bays out of grey mares (A P Time, Code of Conduct, etc.), or are you looking for bays out of chestnuts only? I don't really know exactly how that works
Okay so quick lesson in genotype and phenotype with basic horse colours
(I don't know how familiar you are with genetics so forgive me if I go over some basic stuff you already know)
Capital letter means the allele is present, lowercase means it isn't. If a horse has two copies of a gene, then it is Homozygous. If it has one copy of a gene it is Heterozygous. A Homozygous gene will always pass on one copy of said gene to offpsring. A heterozygous has a 50% chance to pass it on.
First off, the most basic colour horses have is red ie Chestnut which is indicated as CC. If you removed every optional gene, a horse would be chestnut.
Extension is the black gene, and is dominant over Chestnut.
Agouti is reponsible for bay, and has a little quirk - on its own, it can't be expressed phenotypically, so a horse with Agouti and C would be Chestnut. However, in order for Agouti to be active, it needs to work with Extension.
So basically...
Chestnut: ee ?? CC (basically the genotype combinations for Chestnut are: ee aa CC, ee Aa CC and ee AA CC)
Black: E? aa CC (Possible genotype combination is Ee aa CC or EE aa CC)
Bay: E? A? CC (possible genotype combinations are Ee Aa CC, Ee AA CC, EE AA CC, EE Aa CC).
Now depending on genotype, different combinations can get you different colours.
Let's label our genotypes to look at the possibilities.
Chestnut = ee aa CC
Chestnut 2 = ee Aa CC
Chestnut 3 = ee AA CC
Black = Ee aa CC
Black 2 = EE aa CC
Bay = Ee Aa CC
Bay 2 = Ee AA CC
Bay 3 = EE Aa CC
Bay 4 = EE AA CC (will always produce a Bay-based horse)
So...
Chestnut + Chestnut = Chestnut
Chestnut + Chestnut 2 = Chestnut, Chestnut 2
Chestnut 2 + Chestnut 2 = Chestnut, Chestnut, Chestnut 3
Chestnut 3 + Chestnut 2 = Chestnut 2, Chestnut 3
Chestnut 3 + Chestnut 3 = Chestnut 3
Black + Black = Black or Black 2 as well as Chestnut
Black 2 + Black = Black, Black 2
Black 2 + Black 2 = Black 2
Black + Chestnut = Black or Chestnut
Black 2 + Chestnut = Black
Black + Bay = Black, Black 2, Bay, Bay 3, Chestnut or Chestnut 2
Black + Bay 2 = Bay, Bay 3, Chestnut 2 (you can never get a black-based horse out of an AA genotype)
Black + Bay 3 = Black, Black 2, Bay, Bay 3
Black + Bay 4 = Bay, Bay 3 (You can never get a black-based horse out of an AA genotype, nor can you get a chestnut out of an EE genotype)
Black 2 + Bay = Black, Black 2, Bay, Bay 3 (you can never get a chestnut-based horse out of an EE genotype)
Black 2 + Bay 2 = Bay, Bay 3
Black 2 + Bay 3 = Black 2, Bay 3
Black 2 + Bay 4 = Bay 3
Bay + Bay = Bay, Bay 2, Bay 3, Bay 4, Chestnut, Chestnut 2, Chestnut 3, Black, Black 2
Bay + Bay 2 = Bay, Bay 2, Chestnut 2, Chestnut 3
Bay + Bay 3 = Black, Black 2, Bay 3, Bay 4
Bay + Bay 4 = Bay, Bay 2, Bay 3, Bay 4
Bay 2 + Bay 2 = Bay 2, Bay 4, Chestnut 3
Bay 2 + Bay 3 = Bay, Bay 2, Bay 3, Bay 4
Bay 2 + Bay 4 = Bay 2, Bay 4
Bay 3 + Bay 3 = Black 2, Bay 3, Bay 4
Bay 3 + Bay 4 = Bay 3, Bay 4
Bay 4 + Bay 4 = Bay 4
Bay + Chestnut = Bay, Chestnut, Chestnut 2, Black
Bay + Chestnut 2 = Bay, Bay 2, Chestnut, Chestnut 2, Chestnut 3, Black
Bay + Chestnut 3 = Bay, Bay 2, Chestnut 2, Chestnut 3
Bay 2 + Chestnut = Bay, Chestnut 2, Chestnut 3
Bay 2 + Chestnut 2 = Bay, Bay 2, Chestnut 2, Chestnut 3
Bay 2 + Chestnut 3 = Bay 2, Chestnut 3
Bay 3 + Chestnut = Bay, Black
Bay 3 + Chestnut 2 = Bay, Bay 2, Black
Bay 3 + Chestnut 3 = Bay, Bay 2
Bay 4 + Chestnut = Bay
Bay 4 + Chestnut 2 = Bay, Bay 2
Bay 4 + Chestnut 3 = Bay 2
Yes that got old really quick but it is a really slow day lmao. As someone already mentioned Grey is a separate gene (marked as Gg and it acts on top of the base (similarly to dilute colours). So based on his progeny and Ancestry, Tapit's genotype is:
e? ?? CC Gg (maybe a Spl for splash or Sbn for Sabino somewhere in there given the kind of markings he throws)
If I were to make an educated guess I would say he carries Agouti, he could probably even be homozygous for Agouti (has he ever thrown Black?) and he likely is a Chestnut though there is a very slim chance that he's a bay so his profile probably looks like ee Aa CC Gg. A lot is possible given his pedigree... and his progeny. Only thing we know for sure is he is not homozygous for the Extension gene.
