Horse Racing Forum - USA Thoroughbred Races

http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing/ ... n-showcase

I may sound cynical, but I think about 80% of those horses ought to be gelded and rehomed; for the advancement of the breed.

I understand the need for regional sires, but I think you have a point. If I had mares, I'd go to these stallions based on their on-track performance, pedigree, and overall look
Birdrun
domestic dispute
doneraile court
Kipling
Mustanfar
Saintly Look
Scrimshaw
Strong Hope
Toccet

is it me?or does uptowncharleybrown look like a quarter horse in his pic?

swale1984 wrote:I understand the need for regional sires, but I think you have a point. If I had mares, I'd go to these stallions based on their on-track performance, pedigree, and overall look
Birdrun
domestic dispute
doneraile court
Kipling
Mustanfar
Saintly Look
Scrimshaw
Strong Hope
Toccet

These especially, hubba hubba.

TapitsGal wrote:is it me?or does uptowncharleybrown look like a quarter horse in his pic?

A bit, but I think that Mustang Jock wins that contest.

As an Ohioan, I love that Birdrun and Kettle Corn are coming here. Maybe their pedigrees don't sparkle to KY breeders, but they were both durable enough to deserve a fair chance in a better market than what Ohio has.

That being said, I wish them (and their respective stud farms) the best of luck and I'm very much looking forward to seeing their babies run. =D

DONERAILE COURT is by Seattle Slew - there can't be many of those around.

Calypso wrote:As an Ohioan, I love that Birdrun and Kettle Corn are coming here. Maybe their pedigrees don't sparkle to KY breeders, but they were both durable enough to deserve a fair chance in a better market than what Ohio has.

That being said, I wish them (and their respective stud farms) the best of luck and I'm very much looking forward to seeing their babies run. =D

I'm a native Ohioan, and I agree with you, but honestly Ohio breeders will probably improve their stock by having those two stallions standing there, and that is the point of a regional sire. The only reason I didn't include Kettle Corn on my list was that the picture of him wasn't a conformation shot, and I honestly can't remember what he looks like. I'm picky about legs and ankles especially. In fact, I'm very skeptical of the whole Unbridled's Song line, but Domestic Dispute didn't seem to have the thin legs that it seems that so many of his progeny have.

Bold Warrior is a nice enough looking horse and he has a high dollar pedigree but apparently couldn't run worth a lick.

Bold Warrior looks so fine-boned, IMO.
Kettle Corn is a really nice addition to Ohio. Anyone seen him in person? I am curious why he started out as a claiming horse (legs on backwards?). Doesn't really matter, I guess. He ended up being a pretty good racehorse.

I actually really like Gold Case and Crafty Shaw. Gold Case has produced some really nice, hard-knocking horses. He isn't seeing the mares he saw at Adena, but for $500, he's a steal.
Crafty Shaw is not fashionable at all, but he's also produced some quality. I worked with a gelding by Crafty Shaw and he was a huge strapping horse that could run all day. Crafty Prospector himself was a big-boned boy too.

I also really like Tactical Cat and Toccet for $2500, sure! He's good value. Tactical Cat is a useful broodmare sire, although I think his best are from his days at Overbrook. Erhu (the dam of Onlyforyou and Dress the Part) and Like A Gem (dam of Hard Not To Like) comes to mind.

I think the problem is the "well-bred" horses like the one out of Ashado, Hollywood Story etc. who were either unsound or couldn't run a lick. They have no business standing stud. There are plenty of well-bred horses that CAN run.

swale1984 wrote:

Calypso wrote:As an Ohioan, I love that Birdrun and Kettle Corn are coming here. Maybe their pedigrees don't sparkle to KY breeders, but they were both durable enough to deserve a fair chance in a better market than what Ohio has.

That being said, I wish them (and their respective stud farms) the best of luck and I'm very much looking forward to seeing their babies run. =D

I'm a native Ohioan, and I agree with you, but honestly Ohio breeders will probably improve their stock by having those two stallions standing there, and that is the point of a regional sire. The only reason I didn't include Kettle Corn on my list was that the picture of him wasn't a conformation shot, and I honestly can't remember what he looks like. I'm picky about legs and ankles especially. In fact, I'm very skeptical of the whole Unbridled's Song line, but Domestic Dispute didn't seem to have the thin legs that it seems that so many of his progeny have.

I can't imagine that OH breeders wouldn't improve their stock. I love what they're doing, trying to improve and upgrade the OH Breeding program by bringing in popular runners from popular KY sires. I'm not particularly surprised Birdrun is here, but Kettle Corn does surprise me. I'd have expected NY/CA/FL for him. Not that I'm complaining. ^_^

Izvestia wrote:\
I think the problem is the "well-bred" horses like the one out of Ashado, Hollywood Story etc. who were either unsound or couldn't run a lick. They have no business standing stud. There are plenty of well-bred horses that CAN run.

True, but applying biomechanics to a breeding program can correct soudness issues by matching unsound stallions with unsound mares, and some top notch broodmares have been unraced.

I absolutely agree with you. But, for the prices they are standing for, there are other options. Better, proven options (listed below), and unproven options with a race record to back them including Flashpoint and Musketier (same price, different region).

There are a few stallions listed same price by Storm Cat and AP Indy, that's the cheapest Bernardini I could find. These 3 are simply riding the tails of their dams:
Bold Warrior (Bernardini-Hollywood Wildcat) $2500 - best of the 3 as he won a MSW and 2 allowance races, and was SP. He only raced 1 year (Apr/11 to Mar/12)
Star Cat (Storm Cat-Ashado) $2500 - unraced
World Renowned (AP Indy-Splendid Blended) $2500 - broke his maiden for claiming $20,000 price in his 13th start, won his next, then went downhill from there. Was claimed for $8000 in his 2nd to last start.

Standing for $2500:
Catienus (also by Storm Cat)
D'Funnybone
Horse Greeley
Kipling
Lucky Pulpit (although it might go up thanks to California Chrome)
Marino Marini (also by Storm Cat)
Medallist
Mobil
Sea of Secrets (also by Storm Cat)
Strut the Stage

I know that there needs to be stallions at all levels and all prices, but I also think that stallions like Star Cat are not needed. There will be a whole group of quality horses retiring this year and the next. Also, the mares they will see in states like Ohio/Oklahoma/Colorado (wherever) may not move them up. Maybe the genetics deep inside will kick in and they will be the next _____ but that is very unusual.

Good point! Honestly, I like to see a lot of starts on a stallion. I'd never breed to a New Year's Day, etc. that couldn't even make it out of the 2YO season without being injured and retired. I was just sort of playing devil's advocate inasmuchas it *could* happen.

Fair enough.
I enjoyed looking it up, gave me something to do rather than do work.

Wild and Wicked is interesting, he's a total outcross pedigree, 1/2 to The Wicked North and he's gotten some decent foals from very very limited opportunities.
http://www.pedigreequery.com/wild+and+wicked2

Miss Woodford, I don't think I noticed he was on there. I love love love Wild Again-Icecapade (I'm a huge of Offlee Wild, Milwaukee Brew, and Wild Rush- who I wish they hadn't sold to Japan).
Wild and Wicked looks a little back at the knee in his left front, and a bit sickle-hocked in that shot.
He's got some pretty fair numbers from a small amount of foals- 75% runners, 63% winners, 8% SW. AE 1.25 and CI 1.65