Who is going to move?

[Slewfan2]

Edit:how are honor AP and honor code I won't be surprised if one of them goes from lanes end

Honor AP doesn't have foals of racing age, his oldest are yearlings.
Honor Code, Lane's End might hold onto him. They don't sell stallions as fast as other farms. But I would say not great.

How are honor aps babies at sales? How often do they sell stallions? I can't even remember the last one they sold

He had one sell at Fasig Tipton July for $85,000...and only has 1 at Saratoga. His weanlings and mares in foal did not sell well last year, so I’d lower my expectations. The market won’t be good for him until he proves he’s not his sire

[Flanders]

Hearing Palace Malice has been pensioned from stud.

Aww must not be getting love from breeders

They gave him a 2nd chance after Structor won the 2019 BC Juvenile Turf. He covered 207 mares in 2020 at 25k, resulting in 155 live foals and I guarantee those breeders regretted it. The problem is Structor got injured in his only start at 3 when finishing off the board, when he was almost back he got injured again and retired. His next best, Mr. Monomoy got injured early at 3 and was retired. He had 2 others that won G3 Stakes but didn't do much else. Then the 2021 crop hit the yearling sales last year, the yearlings were selling for 20k average. Breeders don't want to lose money, half the ones that went through the ring (35) were bought for 1k to 10k. Only 13 sold for more than the stud fee and some of those weren't profits for the breeder.

[Justahorse]

Hearing Palace Malice has been pensioned from stud.

Aww must not be getting love from breeders

They gave him a 2nd chance after Structor won the 2019 BC Juvenile Turf. He covered 207 mares in 2020 at 25k, resulting in 155 live foals and I guarantee those breeders regretted it. The problem is Structor got injured in his only start at 3 when finishing off the board, when he was almost back he got injured again and retired. His next best, Mr. Monomoy got injured early at 3 and was retired. He had 2 others that won G3 Stakes but didn't do much else. Then the 2021 crop hit the yearling sales last year, the yearlings were selling for 20k average. Breeders don't want to lose money, half the ones that went through the ring (35) were bought for 1k to 10k. Only 13 sold for more than the stud fee and some of those weren't profits for the breeder.

I'm surprised they didn't move him to Texas or somethin

[PersonalE]

Wouldn't be shocked if Mastery got sold on. I know he is at Claiborne and they give them longer chances than others, same with the Lane's End stallions. But he is not doing well and I wouldn't be surprised if his 2023 RMB is going to be in the single digits again.

I'd also add any stallion at Calumet but never know what they are going to do.

1. Why is Lea still there?

Lea is still at Clairborne bc he’s a homebred & they will supply him few mares annually. He’ll eventually be pensioned (rather than sold) since he’s owned & bred by Claiborne.

[Palace Malice]

Hearing Palace Malice has been pensioned from stud.

I hope he spends all of his days out in the pasture and relaxing in the sun They cannot all succeed at stud...

[mariasmon]

Hearing Palace Malice has been pensioned from stud.

I hope he spends all of his days out in the pasture and relaxing in the sun They cannot all succeed at stud...

I believe he is being retrained. Hopefully he can succeed at something else.

[mariasmon]

Hearing Palace Malice has been pensioned from stud.

I hope he spends all of his days out in the pasture and relaxing in the sun They cannot all succeed at stud...

I believe he is being retrained. Hopefully he can succeed at something else.

Okay, false alarm. He is still at Three Chimneys and NOT being pensioned as far as I know.

[brunanas]

given Spun to Run only bred 22 mares this year (down from 66 from this year), i'm guessing he won't be sticking around long...

[Justahorse]

given Spun to Run only bred 22 mares this year (down from 66 from this year), i'm guessing he won't be sticking around long...

I don't think hard spun has been a sire of sires. I think people would rather breed to him than a son of his

[Flanders]

given Spun to Run only bred 22 mares this year (down from 66 from this year), i'm guessing he won't be sticking around long...

I don't think hard spun has been a sire of sires. I think people would rather breed to him than a son of his

He hasn't had enough sons at stud with foals of racing age to even form an opinion.

[Justahorse]

given Spun to Run only bred 22 mares this year (down from 66 from this year), i'm guessing he won't be sticking around long...

I don't think hard spun has been a sire of sires. I think people would rather breed to him than a son of his

He hasn't had enough sons at stud with foals of racing age to even form an opinion.

Really? I thought he's been around forever time means nothing to me I guess.

[Flanders]

I don't think hard spun has been a sire of sires. I think people would rather breed to him than a son of his

He hasn't had enough sons at stud with foals of racing age to even form an opinion.

Really? I thought he's been around forever time means nothing to me I guess.

He is the same age as Street Sense and Curlin, though Curlin went to stud a year later. But the only son that stood in Kentucky with foals of racing age that I can think of was Wicked Strong. He has 2 I can think of in regional markets. So many of his early better runners were fillies and mares or geldings. Street Sense hasn't even had a son standing in Kentucky with foals of racing age, though he does have 3 sons at stud in Kentucky now. Curlin is obviously different, though all 3 are very nice stallions.

[BaroqueAgain1]

2004 gave us a helluva good crop of horses - Street Sense, Curlin, Rags To Riches, Hard Spun, Zenyatta.
I think I may have forgotten someone (been hot enough here to broil brain cells), so if you guys think of anyone else.....? TIA.

[Justahorse]

2004 gave us a helluva good crop of horses - Street Sense, Curlin, Rags To Riches, Hard Spun, Zenyatta.
I think I may have forgotten someone (been hot enough here to broil brain cells), so if you guys think of anyone else.....? TIA.

I feel that it's been raining non stop here

[Justahorse]

He hasn't had enough sons at stud with foals of racing age to even form an opinion.

Really? I thought he's been around forever time means nothing to me I guess.

He is the same age as Street Sense and Curlin, though Curlin went to stud a year later. But the only son that stood in Kentucky with foals of racing age that I can think of was Wicked Strong. He has 2 I can think of in regional markets. So many of his early better runners were fillies and mares or geldings. Street Sense hasn't even had a son standing in Kentucky with foals of racing age, though he does have 3 sons at stud in Kentucky now. Curlin is obviously different, though all 3 are very nice stallions.

Thank ya

[TapitsGal]

this is interesting!

Calumet:
i've said this before and i'll say it again, i don't understand how Calumet even maintains their stallions to begin with. so it's a very tricky question. honestly, any of them? who knows...

Claiborne:
Mastery? maybe? however if they have kept Lea after all this time, i'm not too sure if they're really planning on selling any stallions for the time being.

Coolmore:
from the three you listed — i think Mendelssohn stays for a few more seasons just based on who his half-brother is. Cupid and Mo Town, in the other hand... maaaybe Cupid stays for another season? Mo Town likely gets sold to a regional market, imo. now, this might be a stretch because i don't think Coolmore has ever sold a stallion before their progeny hit the track, but i wouldn't be too surprised if they got rid of Maximum Security based on his sales alone. and from what i've seen, his books are... kinda mediocre. can't blame the breeders, i guess. if not now, unless he is a success, i see him getting sold before the 2026 season at most (but we're still very far away from that ). i wouldn't be shocked if Lookin at Lucky also gets sent down to Chile permanently, maybe not now, though.

Darby Dan:
not in this particular order — Dolphus, Tale of Silence and just judging by how his first foals are doing in general, Copper Bullet?

Gainesway:
i'm not sure if they're big on selling their stallions, to be honest? but if i have to choose one, Tapwrit.

Lane's End:
same as Gainesway. if i have to pick (in order): West Coast, The Factor, Unified and maybe Tonalist? and i honestly think that they'll only keep Honor Code for a long(er) period of time because of his sire. City of Light, Catalina Cruiser and Accelerate also don't seem to be doing well. if they sold their stallions more often, i wouldn't be surprised if Daredevil returned to Turkey.

Three Chimneys:
Palace Malice — also don't know how he's still there (or in Kentucky) — and Sharp Azteca (who also took a big blow with all the Servis/Navarro crap). i'd also like to think they'll give Funtastic more time. i'd say he is third in line.

Spendthrift:
agree with all four you pointed out, i think they’re the most likely ones to get the boot for 2024. plus, maybe, Jimmy Creed? and kinda early into the 2yo season, but i also vote for Coal Front. iirc, he has never bred big books (which everyone knows is a big must to stay at Spendthrift ) and seems to be the worst one among their class of first crop sires.

WinStar:
absolutely, without a shadow of doubt, Always Dreaming — i was honestly surprised that he was still there for this season. then, unless his foals start picking up soon, Yoshida? could use the same line of thought for Audible, but i don't think they'll drop a son of Into Mischief that fast. i'm not sure about Good Samaritan, but i guess i wouldn't be surprised if he did stay in Chile permanently. i'll use the same explanation i used for Maximum Security with Tom's d'Etat — maybe not now, but soon. though i think they never expected big things from him (did Coolmore expect big things from Maximum Security when he retired?).

ETA: didn't even really realize Hill n' Dale wasn't listed — so, uh... Lost Treasure — what is he doing in Kentucky anyways? — and World of Trouble. surprised he's been there for that long.

Re coolmore: they sold off Hansen before his first foals were even born

[Slewfan2]

Honor AP, at this rate...

[Slewfan2]

Honor Code…see Stallion News

[Justahorse]

Honor Code…see Stallion News

It's a nice fit for him I think

[KeepItSimple]

given Spun to Run only bred 22 mares this year (down from 66 from this year), i'm guessing he won't be sticking around long...

Weird spot for my first post, but 0 Spun to Run was out most of breeding season this year. Not sure why he kept being advertised honestly. Regarding Hard Spun sons in general, the Silver State foals are almost all excellent. Real "wow" horses. Should be interesting to see at the sales.

Not sure how in the world Free Drop Billy is still here, unless there are just no buyers. Des Dempsey was warning people off him at the stallion shows back in 2021.

Dolphus is more or less just boarded at Darby Dan, his owner/breeder is keeping and racing most of his babies. He's a sentimental horse more than anything, and Darby Dan and the owner's farm are neighbors and otherwise VERY closely affiliated.

Mo Town bred 218 mares last year and should have similar numbers this year. He's very unlikely to leave, he's still super popular with breeders.

Jimmy Creed would do much better numbers with far better mares if he wasn't a literal nightmare to breed to. God forbid a mare wear the wrong perfume.

Lea is probably safe at Claiborne unless they get an offer elsewhere. Can never be certain though, as Orb was supposed to be pensioned. But Orb was also a walking liability, I still can't believe that the public was allowed near him!